John Osberg of WNY PGA

 All right. Welcome everyone to year two of Rupp Pfalzgraf, Empire State Entrepreneurs and New York Business Law Podcast, A really fun and informative for for us to showcase our clients, strategic partners and community leaders to talk about relevant issues for entrepreneurs and business owners throughout New York.

As you know by now, my name is David Pfalsgraf and I'm, I'm so fortunate to be the managing partner at Rupp Pfalzgraf, which is a full service law firm headquartered right here in downtown Buffalo, and been in business now the last 25 years. And we have a ton of moment as a law firm, and we're really looking to, try to add some value to our clients, but also to make a, a difference in our community.

And we think this podcast gives us an opportunity to really talk with some interesting guests, one of whom is here with me today, John Osberg. Then I'm gonna turn it over to him in a sec. But before I do that, it's actually a, a, a fun guest for me because I wouldn't be sitting in this, incredible podcast studio.

But for, but for John and his, kind and strategic introduction a couple years ago to Mike and Eric and all of our, our friends now at Incept, and they've been,just a great, great business partner for us, and we've been using them ever since, that introduction that John made. So I'm, I'm very appreciative not only to Mike, and Eric, but also to my special guests for thinking about ways to always add value.

To the relationships that he has. So special, special day here today for, for me, in particular and, and, and so appreciative of, of John, you taking time outta your day. Many you already know because he's got such a great presence on, on LinkedIn and, and other social media. But John Osberg, currently in charge of growth partnerships and development for the PGA of America, here in western New York.

he's an endurance athlete. He's certainly a community leader and he's about a million other things. If we have a couple hours, we're gonna, we're gonna use every minute of that 'cause this guest is, worth everyone here, his story today. So welcome John. Thanks so much. Dave, it's great to be here with you.

It doesn't get old hearing that intro. I'm a, I'm a a, a, I was gonna say a lifelong listener to the podcast. That, is pretty cool. You know, I've certainly appreciate the attribution there. And a shout out to Eric, Eric and team here with Mike and the crew. Everyone here, Allison, you know, Dan, everybody.

It's an amazing special firm. It's like a family. And, you know, going back to 2020 when I got here, you know, as a consultant, I, I had that, that fateful conversation with Mike Devin, the CEO here, a friend of mine, and, turned into, you know, some really cool consulting and then full-time work. And since joined the PGA, it's been over two years now and stay in touch and it's fun to be back.

So here we are. I want to hear, all about your current role at the PGA and ways in which we as a community might be able to support some of the, . Really neat, and unique initiatives that you're pushing on behalf of the, the Western York PGA. But before we do that, I know you've got a very interesting and diverse, background and that, you know, you prove, I think as any, as much as any guest I've had on this show, John, that you know, it's not always a straight line that that brings you from one point to another non-linear.

In my notes, Dave, right there, non-linear, that was not pre-planned. No. But tell tell our listeners, give us a sense of sort of your upbringing and, you know, values that, that you had during your formative years and, and, you know, education a little bit and, and sort of what, what is, what, what led you to Incept back in the, in the early 2020 timeframe?

Yeah, no, that's a great prompt. it's funny, I, I did some homework as I was telling you before we started recording that I went back in time. So I used to be a host for multiple shows. One of them was my own Power of Osmosis, and then here at Incept, the Connect podcast. And it's funny hearing some of the.

You know, you listen to some of these bigger folks, like, you know, some of these bigger podcasts and you hear like David Goggins or Rich Role or, or Jesse or some of these influencers, quote unquote, that like have a similar narrative. And I noticed that I had that trend, so I'm gonna do it again here all these years later on a, on another podcast.

But really Dave, to answer your question, and thank you again for the kind words and for that awesome introduction that was energizing. . Really, I'm the product of a psychologist and a pharmacist. My parents, my dad's a retired, now psychologist and a professor and my mom, a pharmacist, and, both community builders.

Community leaders, and really got a front row seat at what it was like to, be a lover of all people from all walks of life and mindsets. And, you know, really to your point, there's not a straight path, non-linear. I literally have it here as my second bullet point as I've done some prep for this.

'cause this is a big podcast and I wanted to strut my stuff, and make sure that, we had a really engaging conversation. So non-linear for sure. you know, college student and Ag University. In my senior year, I had all these really cool internships. big name brands, you know, Citibank, Bloomberg Global Investment Research Challenge with the CFA Institute.

did I say m and t Bank, right? So, so several big, big, you know, opportunities as, as intern. and then I actually had a, a, an interview and I'll, I'll leave the company nameless, but I didn't get it. It was like my, my, it was like this first shock to my system, still as a college student. Was fortunate though to, you know, have some geographic advantages in terms of living next to the, the owner and starter of a, of a tech company here in town that, you know, before startups are really a thing.

We, again, we were talking offline, Steve Poland, former guest, you know, he was, he's been around the startup scene. you know, I. I remember one day, it was December. I can, it was clear as day, Dave. It's a funny story to tell Brian Lehman is the CEO or was the CEO of ETG. They were just acquired. But, Brian was, is is my family neighbor still my parents' home in Grand Island.

And I'll never forget, I'm outside cleaning my, at the time my mom's hand me down Jaguar xj, ridiculous college kid driving a freaking Jaguar. I'm out here polishing it up and Brian Lehman goes, Hey Brian. Or he goes, Hey John, what are you doing with your life? And I like stopped dead in my tracks to, you know, 21, you know, green kid.

I didn't know what the heck was going on. And I was like, well I'm doing my honor thesis. Like, you know, he's like, I see you on LinkedIn a lot. He's like, you should come work for my startup. It's really, it's a good time. I'm like, cool startup technology, let's do it. And I'll never forget the interview was, is he gives me the address.

It's in East Amherst. I'm not aware of where this is. So I pull into an apartment complex and I'm sitting in my, my Jaguar, by the way, my mom's xj. And I call Brian and go, Brian, I, I go, I'm in an apartment complex. What is this the wrong address? Where's company headquarters? He's like, look up. He goes, look up.

And they're sitting in my, my, at the time, his, you know, the co-founder, BNA Mag Gundo, shout out to Bab. They're sitting in there and I'm like, you guys are in an apartment? What are you doing? He is like, this is our office, man. We just started this thing like three months ago and I had no idea. So it was a great introduction.

Something that I know you are classic, very, Hey dude, classic, literally eating old country buffet subway, like, like dialing for dollars every day. Just, you know, using my personal laptop, my personal phone. We had no clients. So really that kind of gave me what year? Remind me what year? 2012. Yeah. I'll never forget it.

I mean it was, it was wild. So I was an intern for them thinking that hey, this guy John, this kid John me, has this huge LinkedIn network already. 'cause I had been on LinkedIn at that point for about four or five years and LinkedIn was still pretty new. Thousands and thousands of connections. So Brian sees that and says, this kid can network work.

He's had great internships, let's bring him in. He maybe can help us supercharge this thing, which fortunately I was able to to do in some ways. Right. Certainly don't take all the credit, but that business is still around today. They were acquired last year, Brian and Bab, the two, the the two founders.

And, so anyway, so I got this exposure for the first five years of my career, Dave, to what the startup scene was all about and like literally like building something from nothing. And, that was amazing. And then from there I kind of transitioned to a bunch of different startups and smaller sized businesses, including Incept, and have since landed my dream job at the PGA of America, Western New York, where I was a trustee for a good four years.

foundation side helped raise a bunch of money, some amazing causes and partnerships and events and fundraisers and so much so that they were like, dude, you gotta come work for us full time if you, if you want it. And I was like, absolutely. So here we are, two years after that, that PGA role started and it's really, it's cool to be sitting here with you kind of talking through it.

And p we'll get to the PGA. Yeah, more, more. I would, I would think, corporate, I mean, you, you start off super entrepreneurial and we'll talk a lot about lessons. I think for, for our listeners today, which I always like to do with, with the special guests that we're. Blessed to be able to bring on the show like you, John, but, but an immediate lesson that came to mind as you were talking about that, you know, the, the interview and going up to the apartment is, apartment is just how open-minded an entrepreneur has to be, or, you know, it's, it's not always a, a corporate setting that you're gonna find yourself in.

It's not always, you know, a the quintessential or a sexy job or anything like that. It can be, it can be, you know, it can be garages, it can be apartments. And, for you, back in 2012, did it, did it force you to, did. Sort of look at things a little bit differently than coming out of a great school like Niagara, having opportunities to work at more, traditional, employers.

Like a, like a large institutional bank or, or any other, the opportunities I'm, I'm certain that you had coming out of Niagara. What was your mindset then, or how did it change as you began to see how like the real world works for an entrepreneur? No, that's a great question, Dave. It, it was, it was amazing to see again, just like that behind the scenes because that, remember, you know, startups weren't really a sexier thing and in Buffalo at least, until all of a sudden, you know, there was some, there was some things that were under the radar.

Bubbling, and I don't want to take anything away from like Z 80 or any of those individuals. They were amazing. But it was 43 North, I think that really put it on the map literally across the, the world, the country and the world. And that would've been 2014. So in 2012, at least for me, right, 21-year-old college student, I, I had really no idea what a startup was, you know?

Yeah, sure. It's a new business. You're starting your own thing. LLC, whatever it might be. And, so to your question there, it definitely forced, it was forced growth. It was like, you know, I thought I was super excited by it though, right? I had never really thought I'd be working for a, like this. I literally was employee n ber one.

I mean, it was these two tech professionals who were in their forties. And then there's this 21-year-old kid rolling in who's got all this energy as you can feel through the, through the microphone. The screen right now, if you're watching and listening are, are millions of watchers of listeners, by the way, we're gonna.

Manifest that. it's something I used to say on my old shows, man, never happened, but one day we'll get there. We'll get there when I fire a power of osmosis again. So to, so to your question though. Absolutely. And the one thing that clicked really quickly for me, Dave, was like that instant feedback that you would get when you are so close to the starting of a business.

Whereas if I went to a larger firm, I'm gonna be. You know, I hate to say it, but kind of bottom of the totem a little bit where I'm 21, 22 outta college, just got my degree learning my way in this business. It was like, no, John, like you're 21, but we're looking at you like someone who's like an immediate impact maker in this business.

In which over time, in the first six to 12 months, you know, 'cause then I converted to full time. So I had six months of kind of like, it was an internship. And they're like, look, if you do a decent job and we make enough money, we'll bring you in as a full-timer. So literally my graduation date was May 13th, 2013 and May 15th I was in there.

Quote. That's telling full-time. It was wild. That's telling. It was wild. So, so yeah. So it definitely, there was, and like you said, this will be interwoven through our, our conversation today with entrepreneurship. But there's a grid, there's a resilience, that you have to have, that I knew I had 'cause I was an athlete and I had some done some cool things I guess up to that point.

But, it really unlocked a lot of things that I don't think I necessarily had like intangibles, tangibles, because there's some forced growth in that. And despite. your line of study and what was that at Niagara Finance. Economics. Psychology figured, yeah. Should probably, probably should have known that.

But I figured finance was probably in your background, but, but like, getting outta that comfort zone. You know, you go big bank or you go to a, a larger corporation may, maybe you could have played to that strength, but talk, talk to our listeners a little bit about, you used the word grid or resiliency.

I've said open-mindedness before, but I'm, I'm ass ing in those, those formative years. 12 through say 2015 as you're working around the clock helping these guys succeed. But you're doing any, anything and everything there. There's not an entrepreneur who's in one lane, is there? No, it's, it's, it's the GSD mindset, which is get SHIT done.

Right? So GSD for short. So it was like, I, yeah. I won't swear to, to save the explicit tag. We don't wanna do it. Curve off any, any potential listeners. But yeah, GSD was really the mindset, Dave. And, you know, you had to wear a lot of hats. And I think one thing that that was favorable for me was that I was super young and having all these internships and some really, truly incredible exposure to some of the best and brightest in, in our, in our city and and beyond.

I mean, I, I can name off a handful and I'll do it just for fun. Like Doug Stevens from m and t Bank, who's very senior there now, was pretty senior back in 2011. When I was there, I was a, I was a sophomore with an internship, which was to, at the time at least, I was told it was rare. So I was like, I'm gonna take, I'm gonna take every chance I, or whatever I'm gonna, I'm gonna shoot every shot I can while an intern as a, as a 18, 19-year-old, you know, Doug Stevens, Virgil Zain, Patty, Lucas, Chitz, Bruno Def, these are all people that I've.

Here and there. I've stayed in touch with 14, 15 years later. but the point I'm getting to is that, you know, there was, there was something there that it was like, yeah, like as an entrepreneurship, in entrepreneurship coming from these internships, I was, I learned a lot there. And so then I took that as a young 21, 20 2-year-old and applied it because, I don't know, I just have always gravitated to folks that are senior to me, or in the words of our buddy John Gavigan that have seen more of the movie of life.

John, I'm gonna make sure I attribute do that. So you don't take, any, copywriter infringements there. So if you're listening, Johnny, that one's for you. But I just had this natural inclination, Dave, to . To just attach myself to folks that, had seen more of the movie of life and, and just learn from them and use again, like you talked about off air, two years, one mouth.

So, I know we're gonna dive further in at times 'cause I, I, you know, I'm definitely curious to learn more about, you know, your background as a, as a host myself. I'd love to hear some of the things that you've done 25 years for the firm. Amazing. We can get to that, whether it's now or in the next few minutes.

But to your point, yes. You really, as an entrepreneur, you have to be wearing multiple hats. You have to defer any sort of ego, because it can be real easy to say, well, I don't do invoices, or I don't do this, or I don't do that. But it's like, when you want the business to succeed, you'll do whatever it takes.

I think that's such a good lesson and, and such a valuable perspective from someone who's, who's been down that road before. You're, you're, you're not, you know, someone who hasn't been in the trenches or who hasn't done anything and everything that it takes to succeed. It's a little bit, hearkening back to our early days the way I felt too.

So if, if you, you know, drove the fastest and you had to get to FedEx by the time it closed at six, then you were the next person up and you were doing that role no matter what your name was or what your role was at the firm. And, and part of me misses those days when it was just, real, an environment where you, you had no choice but to do those tasks if you're gonna succeed as a, as a business or a business owner.

So, one other thing you said earlier, sort of, I'm interested in exploring with you, and I think it, it goes to the mindset. John that you've always had since the day I've met you, and that's, like leave nothing to chance. You mentioned LinkedIn and it, it's, it's remarkable, I think, studying some of, of your, your LinkedIn profile and some of your, your, you know, friends and colleagues and, and postings.

It's, it's unique. and, and the way you've been able to leverage LinkedIn, not just for your brand or for people's awareness of what you're doing, but for the benefit of our community too and, and starting some really, honest conversations. And it's, it's amazing to me that you're talking about LinkedIn back in the sort of pre 2012 days, 2008 even then.

And how, how, how did that start? Or how, how did you know that this was gonna be sort of, a platform that you would be able to, to leverage and, and, and tell your story around and, and help our community community succeed with? Yeah. Beautiful. No, I, I, I just, if I could just. Pit stop for one second. Dave, I've said this to you before, man.

I just, I love how you are able to just so organically, and this is not a paid for, you know, plug. We can can work on that too. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe one day I cannot help myself because again, you're talking to someone who's hosted a hundred plus shows, whatever, maybe two, maybe even 200 in my career or whatever.

And it's just, it is so refreshing to hear someone, and it's not just you, you as a host, it's you as a person, as a leader. So I don't wanna make this into like a back rubbing massage contest, like, like I've heard people joke about, but I just, the prompt there and the way that you're able to tie things in and you're taking your notes, I'm taking my notes.

It's literally basically like host to host here. We're talking and I love it. your leadership, Dave, seriously, man, the way you speak and the way you carry yourself. It is, it is so refreshing. So thank you first of all. I just wanted to acknowledge that. So appreciated. Oh, a hundred percent. And so, with me just doing the back rubbing massage, what was the prompt again?

'cause I just, just, just about LinkedIn. How LinkedIn. Thank you. How it, it, it's not. An easy, you know, task to, to maintain a high profile and to, to do the hard work. It's, it's not just a fun tool or resource. Mm-hmm. So you had wisdom in, you know, at an early stage or your career to know that there might be utility or value in, in really investing in the time that it takes to maintain a strong brand and profile on LinkedIn.

And so my question is sort of how did you know that LinkedIn was gonna be a, a valuable tool or resource for you back in 2008? N ber one and n ber two? is that another example of sort of going at something all out? Like you're, you're, you're not someone nor are most entrepreneurs who are successful people who are passive or who, you know, push paper around their desk or mm-hmm.

Or take a nine to five approach to their, to their career or their community. So, so. How, how did you have the, early on belief that LinkedIn could lead to successes for you and, and ways to promote, initiatives you're working on or, or things that were important to you or community? And then how much work did it take?

Yeah, I mean, how much do I have to do in order to Yeah, yeah. Enhance my LinkedIn profile, which is probably suffering right now. So that this is a question Sure. That I'm curious about. For my own selfish, I'm interest here. I'm with you. I'm with you. No, thanks for as a good host. Thanks for keeping us on track with me going into that spot off and then forgetting what the heck we were talking about.

So to answer your question, that first part there, I got it written down. Your 1, 2, 3, . It's funny. I wish I had a, I wish I had a better answer. and it's not that, it's not a good answer, but my dad, my dad said to me, I'll never forget it, sitting in the basement of N University, library, he's like, dude, you need to get on LinkedIn.

He's like, you know, this is a hot platform. It's gonna get hot. You know, it's small right now, but think of it as a professional Facebook. And I'll never forget building my LinkedIn. And I've told this story on other shows and to other. People in, in anecdotal, you know, conversations. But I remember Dave, I, I wrote like this ridiculously long s mary about like, I love fishing and all this stupid stuff.

Not really understanding as an, as an 18, I was 18 years old when I got onto it. So it's been over 16 years for me. And, yeah, I mean, and that's part of, part, part and parcel why ETG, the software startup. My first real job was so interested in me was that I had spent those four years leading into that part, you know, building something where I think in the beginning some of it was just who I am, my personality.

and so then all of a sudden you get this internship that turns into a full-time job that turns into five years of zero revenue, zero clients to multimillion dollar with many, many clients across the country, multiple offices across the country. And then from there I left and went to another startup.

But, so I think that all starts with, with LinkedIn and even sitting in this room with you, you here today. You know, I think the way that, I've leveraged or used LinkedIn. Over these 16 years has, has really led to so many of the, my Life's greatest, you know, joys or achievements or accomplishments, whatever you wanna call it.

So I'd say part one of that was my dad, the all out mention you made, yeah, I mean, here we are. Here's a good point to, point out, even though most folks are gonna be listening to this, we're both wearing Garmin on one wrist and whoop on the other. Right? So the Whoop mg, which is a medical grade device, it's their newest, highest end, whoop device.

And you've got a, I've got a Phoenix eight, you've got a a nine 70, which you just recently bought. So to your point, all out is really, it's all gas, no breaks, you know, and, and so I will say with Whoop though, in case for some reason, will, Ahmed, the CEO's listening, yes, I do pay heed, to my, to my recovery days.

but for the most part, whenever I have a chance to go for something, we're gonna go right. so, so all out, to your point, entrepreneurship really is that it's, it's a full contact sport, Dave, and you know it better than most with 25 years. Congrats again at the firm. so yeah, and then you know the all out side of things too, where you're not just shut, you use the phrase shuffling paper.

I said this to you on the phone last Friday, respectfully assertive is kind of like my brand, respectfully assertive. So it's like I'm not gonna annoy people to death and do some of the things that have happened to me on LinkedIn or other platforms, but you know, I wanna be candid, I wanna be direct, I wanna be respectful and say like, Hey, we're talking about X, you know, whatever.

Whether it's a business prospect or a community donor, whatever it might be. Like, I'm just trying to get some clarity on that. And it's been six weeks since you gave me, you know, an update. Like, you know, I'd really appreciate it. You know, and also depressurizing that so. Respectfully assertive inside of the All Out example is some, something that I think that entrepreneurs will identify with.

'cause you have to, you have to get clarity and find those answers while you're, while you're building something. And then lastly, enhancing yours. We could get that done in an hour. Dave, enhancing your LinkedIn, man. What are you doing after this? Listen, dude, with what you have done in your real life. That's the best part though.

You have to have, you have to have credentials. You have to have substance in order for LinkedIn actually work for you, you, my friend. Not that you need my validation, but you have done that and will continue to for, for many, many years, I'm sure on onward. but so that's part one, is you want to be, I call be the same person as the, in the street as you are on the screen.

So sometimes you meet somebody, and this is an example I give, I won't certainly name names, but I'm on a little bit of a diatribe and so I'll cut it after this. But on LinkedIn, you know, some do's and don'ts quickly are, you know, have a, have a recently updated profile picture. Nothing, nothing worse than sitting at, you know, spot coffee or, what is it?

. What the heck's the coffee spot at Washington there? public espresso. Public espresso I was having there. Good shout out for them, right? Big shout out for public. Yes. Spot's mine, but public is the place. I'm sitting there five years ago waiting for this guy that has been LinkedIn, LinkedIn inning me, and I'm sitting there looking around.

I'm messaging, Hey dude, like, I'm here. I don't see you. Where you at? And he's like, no, I'm here. I'm here. And then eventually he spots me. So he's waving and I'm like, I, I'm like, I sorry, who? And they're like, yeah, no, it's me. So and so. And, and then I'm like, so we get, we do the coffee. I'm like, this first five minutes, I'm like, who is?

Oh my God, it's this person. Their picture was 20 years outdated. And then also there's a thing about. How you are on the screen as you are on the street, people are gonna know, like Kyle Simonelli, shout out to our, our buddy Kyle there and his dad, Paul, they, they're two greats there. Kyle said to me, I knew you.

He's like, I knew you before. I actually knew you, John, and it was because of your LinkedIn presence. So, all that to say is this is a great prompting call to action, a CTA for me because I've been a little lax on my LinkedIn game as a new dad. and I also had some feedback recently that came through that was a little bit, shocking, if you will, at in, in some ways that I kind of had to step back from what I was posting on LinkedIn and just kind of reimagine.

But I, I kind of did it before today's podcast. I went back in time and looked at my recent posts and I was like, I need to work on this. So this is a great prompt. That's great. So thank, thank you, Dave. That's great. That's great. I, I have, you need to work on it. Good friend of mine, you may know over at Ferguson Electric, Tom Murray, sort of was an executive coach before one of his clients.

Ferguson brought him in-house, at Ferguson and when he was. Coaching some of our, attorneys. He had a great phrase that I think, you know, speaks, about who you are as a person, John. Mm-hmm. And he used to say, Hey, it's great to have a plan or, a strategy, but what sort of intentional and deliberate behavior are you, are you backing up that plan with?

And it really is a great reminder that whether it's LinkedIn or helping to, a startup succeed, but, but it, it, it takes, you know, we can talk about grit and hard work and initiative, but, but so that intentional behavior mm-hmm. You know, you have to be very mindful of, you know, what your goal is or what you're trying to accomplish.

And, and Tom used to teach all of our lawyers that a, a marketing and business development plan without intentional, and, and deliberate behavior is gonna get you nowhere. So it's, it's that follow through. It's the hard work as you've just talked about, John, that it takes in order, you know, for an entrepreneur in order for a, a young, .

Lawyer to, to succeed. I think it's a, it's a combination of that self-awareness piece and what, what is it that I'm trying to achieve here? And then what steps do I need to take and hold myself accountable to in order to accomplish those goals? And you're a person who sort of I see practicing what you preach.

And it's funny, we'll get into some mental health and some endurance athlete mm-hmm. Topics that I'm excited about. But I, I was going there almost quickly, won't quickly, I won't ruin some, some punchlines or some fun anecdotal stories about how just intentional your behavior is. John, I appreciate that.

But I think, you know, really valuable. LinkedIn is a, is an example of where it shouldn't be superficial or it shouldn't be inconsistent with who you are, as a person, I, I like when you say it should be reflective of your, your values and That's right. And your level of engagement. So that, that's a great takeaway for, for our read, for our listeners.

No doubt. Also, I, so I. So many topics, but one I do want to ask you about in, in ways in which potentially our listeners or our community can support you. I know you're doing just wonderful work for, you know, the western New York division of, of the PGA of America, and it's a unique role and I know you're, a passionate golfer and a very good golfer and always have been your whole life objective.

And, and, I've been out there with you. I know. First I'm not talking a c wasn't the best one there. It wasn't my finest. Tell me about that role, how it came about. Yeah. You know, you're sort of this serial and driven entrepreneur and successful in your own right, but you have a, you have a chance to, to talk with the PGA of of America about really trying to build some moment here in our community.

So how did the role come about? How have you found that role the, the couple of years you've been in it and sort of what do you think? . What sort of impact do you think you're having in our community by virtue of that role? I love it. No, thank you. This is awesome. Yeah, and we'll get to the intentional, deliberate piece about, once we get to the endurance side of things in mental health, but to that, to that prompt, it, it really is, it's funny, it's a story I haven't told in a while and I'll spend the next minute or two just, just shedding light on the origin story of it, Dave.

And, . I planted a seed in 2019 with the folks at PGA at the time, it was Steve Barkow Bakowski, a good friend of mine who's now the CEO of Colorado, PGA, which is a massive section. They have 850 professionals to our 275. So their scale is, is major and he's doing great things out there. So Steve was a friend, through my time in the golf industry locally with Encore Golf and others.

And I planted a sea with, with Steve and said, look man, I love what you're doing here. I love your leadership. I love what, what the PJ stands for. It's the world's largest sports organization with 31,000 plus members. And, I planted a sea with him in 19, kind of a shot in the dark, 'cause it's a small section and we'll get to that in a little bit.

But, small section and foundation. But, planted the seed and, no, no more than six, six to eight months later. you know, Steve had asked me after doing some great volunteer work for them, just complete volunteer, you know, time, energy resources kind of thing. he said, he was like, listen, I've identified you as one of four.

Foundation trustees that we want to start with. and it was, you know, three other individuals who were well known in kind of their respective niches. And, he's like, I'd like you to be one of 'em. What do you think? And I'm like, I'm a hundred man. And that came with a financial commitment. It came with, you know, you know, trusteeship roles as someone who's a financial booster, really.

Right? Sure. And you know how it works. And so I went all in on that and honestly, I never, in my wildest dreams thought I would actually have a chance to, to work there, because when you look at it, Dave, like our section at most has five to six full-time people in, in Western New York. Right. We are the authority of golf.

For those who don't know the PJ of America, specifically western New York. We cover from Niagara down to Buffalo, over to Rochester, and ironically down to the top of Erie. So like PA area. So that is actually in our, in our footprint. So think of them as territories. There are 41 total, we're one of 41. We are ranked 38th for scale.

So they're only. Two or three others that are, are smaller than us. So we're small, but we're the, the mighty that could. And so anyway, in doing all that work, I was then, I had an opportunity forward it to me to come in as Director of development and partnerships, and that was actually July 26. 2023. So just over two years ago.

And so it was just a great story though. I just wanna highlight back to that 2019, you know, planting of the seed. It takes patience, man. You gotta shoot your shot. You gotta be passionate. Another good lesson for sure. Right? And, and just, and just stay with it and do it for the right reasons. you know, I raised a lot, helped raise a lot of money, brought some great partnerships in as a trustee.

fortunately, like I was able to raise enough money where my dues recovered and then some, not surprising. Yeah, I mean, it was, yeah, we're talking, you know, 10 x kind of thing, which is great. So shout out to my partners that help with that. Thank you, Bob. And, and Alex and others. if you're listening, so yeah.

So to, and then the impact to, to your point, like that, to your look back and the impact that we've had. yeah, I mean, we've. I mean, let's just start with vet military veterans. You're a veteran yourself, and thank you for your service and sacrifice. Dave, while we're on this podcast, I've said it to you before, but I'll say it again.

PJ Hope is an amazing, amazing platform helping our patriots everywhere, HOPE. That was how I really got my first taste of what the foundation's all about. So what that does is it takes PJ professionals who are adaptively trained and certified, love the game, love instructing, love giving back. And they then are paired with veterans.

We have a five to one ratio. So for every five veterans, you have to have one pro. There's, you can't go above that. They take special measures to make sure anyone who has special, you know, needs or anything of that nature is taking in account. We're talking folks who might have PTSD so severe that, they can't hear a big bang or something, and so we have to, or they need to sit, if they have, if they're, you know, amputee below the knee or whatever the case may be.

There's all these little things you just don't think about in. It's, it's incredible. Incredible. And in, I invite you, I'd invite you out and some of the team maybe one day in the future. I know we've been talking, between our, our, our organizations and I think the timing is probably more of a 26 thing based on budgets, which is absolutely fair.

but I think coming and seeing what we're doing here for military veterans, so what I would say is impact. I start with two words, saving lives. and then, and then the other phrase I'd use is enhancing lives. And I'm specifically speaking to military for right now because literally we have gotten outcome reports from the va.

Here in Buffalo that have said, you know, this program has saved lives of our veterans in town. based on some of the, you know, again, some of it's hipaa, PHI, so we can't speak too, too deep into that, but, basically you have men and women who are struggling, haven't left the house in six months. PA helping a set of golf clubs is the only thing that got 'em out.

And then reconnecting with their brothers and sisters in arms from, from their military service days. So, that alone I think is enough, but, we do, we do work with, we do work with youth. So we have multiple, you know, junior programs in collaborations with like the first Tee, for instance. we've, we partnered with Buffalo Police Athletic League as well, in the past and all sorts of other, you know, really just, I should also say drive chip and putt.

Matter of fact, we have one tomorrow. it's a solid 12 hour day for our team to be out there making sure our kiddos are having fun as they work their way towards Augusta National in April. Literally the Sunday before, before the, the, the. The first practice round for, the masters. Pretty cool.

Amazing. So that, that, and we've actually had some local folks qualify. Pretty cool. Yeah. So, so you got young people on the i diversity city side of things too, where we have a lot of collaborative efforts going with some of our trustees, coach Ron Langhorn, for instance. if you've ever heard of the Jim Horn Foundation, coach Ron is a product of that.

He went through, Mr. Horn's, golf, you know, instruction. And not just that, but life coaching and stuff for, for all people. spec specifically inner city. And, I know Ron, one of his goals in his, his life and his career is he's a trustee of ours, like I mentioned, is to really take on that mantle of what Mr.

Horn's built. I know Mr. Horn's in his nineties now and is an amazing man. but a guy like Coach Ron, who's, you know, really diversifying the game of golf as a trustee of ours, but really just on his own free of him being a trustee. He's been an amazing force for good in the east side of Buffalo where he hails from.

And so, we've got a thing called PGA Works, which actually is a fellowship program inside of our foundation that is a, it used to be a 12 month thing, but now it's a six month. Fellowship that we're actually underwriting extra months on, where we are then giving fellowships to people who are typically untraditional and, and, and call it sports, but also in golf.

so we're doing everything we can through some grassroots efforts, some of our, our boots on the ground, and then just some other one-off stuff that we're doing to just keep planting seeds so that people of color who historically have not had a chance to play the game that we all love you and I love, have more chances to.

So on the foundation side, a ton of impact on the, the professional side. We've got great professionals who are helping fuel this programming and they're having fun, they're playing in great golf tournaments and, you know, they're, they're helping grow the game as well. It's a mouthful. Well, I was gonna use a word and then you stole it from me.

'cause yeah. Impact. Yeah. You know, when I think about, you know, your career path, John, and, you know, 2012 through, say 2019 when you had this fortuitous conversation, but impact in different ways. And then as your career progresses, you see that there's an ability for you and, and the skills and the personality that you have to have even sort of broader impact in our community, whether it's with, with children's, you know, disadvantaged individuals, our, our our nation's.

Military veterans, but I love that, that no matter what you're involved in, you're guided by, by high, high principles of how can I maximize this opportunity for others. It's, it's really, it's sort of a neat characteristic or, or quality or trait. And I think, you know, many of the guests that I've had on this show are many of the leaders that, in our community that I admire and look up to, just the, it, it, their, their ability to, change the lives of others is profound.

And it's, it's not just what's in front of you today, but it's what can we do as an organization or what can we do as a law firm or what can we do as a, a community to, to think about. Those who haven't had these chances that we've had. And so I, I, I just love using, you know, golf as a metaphor for life.

But, but, but your ability to have, an idea or, or see something that was intriguing to you and sort of take a step back from, call it a, like a, you know, what, what the normal path an entrepreneur would lead or launch your own business or do this or do that. And maybe, maybe all that remains, in your future, someday, John, but for today, you're focused on creating the greatest impact that you can, that that's really, unique.

And I think it's admirable. And, and I love that no matter what you have going on, you're, you're, you're, you're gonna, you're gonna change people's lives that, that are around you. That, that's, that's kind of cool. Thanks, Dave. Yeah. And, and listen, just, I appreciate that shout out and, and kind words. And one thing I'll say to those listening, you know, I, I remember going back.

You know, to 20 14, 20 15 when I had a little bit of a lull in what we'll call like my volunteer work experience, right? If you will. Like I, in college they make you do a bunch of hours and, and in high school, same thing. And I kind of had a na natural inclination to that, but I'll never forget, an old friend and mentor who was part of four eighth North, one of the earlier winners in 2015, her name's Christine Bird.

she's now out in LA doing great things in psychology for UCLA. but I'd never forget her, you know, being that final push for me as a friend and a mentor. 'cause I was like, you know, I wanna do stuff with the first tee, you know, this and that, but I don't know what to do. And you know, you get in your head, right?

So you're like, oh, there's probably already all these coaches and there's. They don't need me. What do they need me for? And I'll never forget we're sitting, you know, hanging out. I dunno, we were probably at some restaurant or something and she's like, dude, she's, you know, she's using expletive. She's like, get your a SS Right.

Get it going and make that call. And if you don't make it by tomorrow, I'm gonna be following up on you. I'm gonna stay on you until you do it. So Christina, by some chance, I haven't seen Christina talk to her in so many years. She was such a great friend. Is a great friend. And if she's listening. You know, shout out to her, but we'll send it to her.

Yeah. And I, I'm literally gonna send it to her once this is live, but I'll just, and, and this lastly, that sounds really big, right? You hear all these things about hope and, and saving lives and enhancing lives and planting seeds and letting six years go by, or whatever it was, four years go by, but. At the same time.

One thing that I love is just simple gestures of kindness. you know, someone approaches you on the street, whatever their story is, giving them the time of day, looking them in the eye, speaking with them, acknowledging their presence, a smile, a nod, a hello, a hey, how you doing? Even if it's rhetorical, you know, just that acknowledgement is powerful.

I know there's times where I might be down and out and I like, dude, I was in the gym the other day. This is a sidebar quick thing. This guy goes and weighs himself on, on the, in the weight, in the weight. I, I go to a FC, aquatic fitness center in Twanda, and this dude's in, he's, you know, shirtless older guy.

He goes over and he's weighing himself, well, I'm getting my gear on. I just got outta the steam in the sauna, which I know you're a big steam sauna guy. I'm a little lethargic. I, I had my air AirPods in and I hear him go, you know, I won't yell too loud the mic, but he's like, woo. So I'm like doing my laces and I look over and this guy's coming at me, you know, a little older, whatever, and he's like, you know, it's great when you lose that weight.

It's really great. So I'm like, I'm like, you know. Yes sir. You got it brother. Let's go. I love the energy. So I'm tying my shoes, getting ready to rock. He's still talking to me. I got my AirPods in noise canceling mode, so I like turn and look and I take my AirPod. I was like, you know, 67. I'm really working hard.

you know, I'm proud of myself. I don't wanna sound cocky or arrogant, but you know, I'm running, I'm lifting, I'm riding, I'm doing all these things 'cause I love to. He goes, I love to eat. I love to eat. I can't stop eating. He's like, so I'm like, I like, like, I don't know this guy from Adam, but he's just like unloading all this great positive energy on me.

That's great. Like literally. And I put my AirPod one more time, I put it back in and he still was talking, so I had to take it out. That's great. So the point I'm making is like, that was just a little conversation. I don't know if he recognized my body language and I was a little bit tired and, but whether he did or didn't, regardless the outcome was that I was amped up after that.

I'm like, this seven 67-year-old dude out here mecking it with great energy and great outlook. Let's go in there. And I was in there for 98 minutes from there, working out, I can do this too. Yeah. So, so just little things. That's a perfect example. Yeah. Sorry to rant. Just I love man how to, how to find energy and little things and pay it forward.

And I, I wanna ask you about that. 'cause another area. John and what you've inspired me and others is sort of on this mental health and physical fitness journey. That's always, you know, I've, been front and center for you and I'll just tell a quick anecdotal story. I know you're going that, that, that my, you know, group of, of my one, my son Jack's friends.

Got behind some, mental health for, for, you know, guys in their twenties and thirties that had been struggling and created this mind over, miles or, challenge and, and you know, we had them on the show a few months back, right? And they told some really inspiring stories about some adversity that, that they were trying to overcome and, and how they used this walk around Delaware Park, this 24 hour run walk around Delaware Park in the first year.

They had 12 or 15 participants this year they probably had close to a hundred. They've raised a ton of money, to help promote, mental health awareness. So something to be, you know, very proud of these 20 something year old kids. Well, I, I get there at the start and of course my, my good buddy John is there at the start and, and I figure he is gonna stay for an hour or two, like the rest, full mustache by the way, for the listen listeners, like the rest of my guys and full mustache.

So I come back, I think I, I probably stay for an hour or two and like I thought everyone else did, and then I, I probably go have dinner and I come back a little bit. before, bedtime, and there's John still running. He's got a line on his helmet now. I figured, all right, midnight, this guy is definitely gonna be outta here.

And so I literally get back to Delaware Park about 6:00 AM the next morning and who was still there. But John, this guy, I'm like, this is unbelievable. He was one of like, I don't know, know six people that made it, you know, around the clock and, and for no other reason that, you, you wanted to show them and.

That, you know, that you could do it too. And, and, and you were with them and, and not only mentally, but, but physically, and I know that made a, a lasting impact. Mm-hmm. On, on those, on those young men that were there and looking up to you for saying how with it, I'm a, I'm a dad and I'm a, you know, married and I should be home, a warm man, but out here in Delaware Park and losing a screw with these, these guys.

So I think as, as an example, John, of where I think, you, you sort of lead by example or you're not afraid to, get your hands, you know, dirty and, and in it. but, but I know that that mental health journey, that that commitment you've had to, to physical fitness and endurance training, we can call it or, or, but, but when did that fire begin to build in you?

Or what, what's that been like? Both of. Challenges of it, which I know are real, but also some of the rewarding outcomes that you've seen when you've been vulnerable or when you've been able to do an event like that, or talk to others about, you know, things that you've, gone through in, in your life.

What, what, what is that metaphor of, of athletics, and, you know, endurance. Why do you do what you do? What, what, what are you getting out of it that you make this tremendous investment in, in sort of your, your physical and mental health wellbeing? Love it. Well, we're gonna j p back a way. That's a long question.

No, no, you're good. I followed you if there was a question in there. I, Dave, I followed you six ways of Sunday, buddy. I'm with you, buddy. no, no, no. That's awesome. I will just, I'll start by saying this and then I'm gonna backtrack. But, but that last prompt, it's training for life and we're gonna get to that.

And I, this is like super exciting because I'm hearing, I'm hearing all the, the, the podcasts in my brain with Goggins and Rich Roll and Jesse Itzler and these big time, you know. In Influe, I hate, again, I hate that word in a way, but influencers or just really notable people, that training for life mindset is at the core of all of it.

So we're gonna, we're gonna get to that. Let's go back though for 2025. Mind, mind over. So shout out to Nick Ennis. Max Montani. I learned of this event, months after it happened in its inception format, which was 2024. They raising the 60 K, 60 70 k, dollars, for, you know, it was, I wanna say it was a mixture of children's.

And then also, there was a, a suicide prevention, foundation that they were working with close out. I believe it's outta Western New York. So this year they came even bigger and better. after I had known about it, I had been training, you know, as a, as a new dad. This was literally marked on my calendar.

I I learned of it in October, I wanna say, of 2024. No joke went in my calendar. I set like a three month reminder. All these things, you know, I knew that I'd be a little bit blown out as a new dad and, trained my butt off for it. And so this year they raised a hundred k plus. Amazing. Nick ran 74 miles, ran, walk, whatever.

It's an ultra. So for those who don't know, an ultra marathon is you do not run the entire time. There's, there's a nap, there's, you know, changing your shoes, there's going to the bathroom, there's eating a sandwich, a bagel. . All these things. So in, in 24 hours, Nick ran 74 miles. Amazing. And Max ran 91.

Incredible. So when, when you say run, there's a run walk aspect to it. You're never always gonna be running the entire time. It's just not a thing. but so for those who are uninitiated in the ultra circuits, that's what that is. So shout out to those dudes. first of all too, I just, this is a sidebar.

You had mentioned I had a light on my helmet for our listeners. I wasn't wearing a helmet while running. I promise that was later. 'cause I was so tired. I'm No, no. I never wore a helmet. But when you set helmet, I was like, geez, man, if I was wearing a you, you were hallucinating. I was 3:00 AM the minds like you were?

No, I was not wearing a helmet. I had a, I had a hat on. It was a hat. And when you, I wrote in my notes, he said, helmet, I was dying. I'm like, my dad's gonna listen to this and be like, yo, he was wearing a helmet. That kid. but I just wanna shout you out, Dave. Again, not like that. Isn't funny. Said I wrote that.

That's a fair correction when you wrote that. That's not a helmet, guys. I was not wearing a helmet, I swear, while winning. That was for later. No, I wanna shout you out, Dave. And really not to, you know, I mean, there's a lot of good energy here and a lot of gratitude both ways, but man, what a great dad. Guys listening, you know, gender neutral guys, by the way.

men and women listening, how many dads are gonna sacrifice their sleep? It was not a warm may evening, by the way. It got to like 50 and windy and it was not good, especially if you're running the entire time and you tried to take a nap, which I did mistakenly, and that kind of derailed me. I only got to 70 miles.

We'll get to that. Pretty good. But I remember seeing you, Dave. I remember seeing you Dave out there. I'm telling you man. It honestly got, as a new dad, it made me emotional. And maybe it was because I was at this like visceral form, you know, this truly elemental form that I was in with, you know, just literally not stopping.

I mean, I, I have a lot of notes to take 'cause Max and Max and Nick both did a lot, a lot of things differently than I did. my goal was a hundred. I had a Quadra L bor injury that I was working through for the, the leading up to three or four weeks prior to the event. So I, I almost didn't show up.

And, fortunately I was able to grid it through using that word grid again, like we talked about earlier in the podcast. And, I got into, got about 70 miles in, in 20 hours. I left, I left after 20 hours. 'cause I, I did have a baby at home and I was like, you know what? I don't want to blow myself up here.

It's so bad that I can't, 'cause I have a, I have a few other alters coming up, but I just wanna shout you out, Dave, because when I saw that man, I got emotional honestly. I was like, what a freaking great dad. Aw, that's, I mean, seriously, Dave like. Your energy. You're out there. You covered what, 30 miles yourself?

I think I did saw 20, 30. 30, 40. Something like that. 30, 40. I mean, yeah. See, I'm 30 40. Forgive me. So like to see, to imagine that, you know, imagine any dad listening out there. You've got your son who's who I know had an ankle thing going on, leading into the event. He's one of the, organizers is, is, is directly involved with Mind over with Max and.

And here's Dave Fallsgraph, managing partner, Ru Fallsgraph, LLC at 3:00 AM at 3:00 AM and it's windy and it's cold and it's dark and there's no one around. And there he is this man looking for his son so he can walk with them and cover 30 to 40 miles. So if there was a way to hit a clap button right now and with this mixer I'm looking at and Inep studio man there's a clap button because that's deserved.

So appreciate it. Seriously, dude, Dave, appreciate it. Dave, that was, that was amazing. It was fun being there with you too. That was just such a silver line. Yeah, just see, seeing me there like, dude, it was so fun. Like what are you still doing here? And honestly, I had, I had a hundred plus miles is my goal in 24 hours, but I, I just had a, you know, using my whoop and just using that mindset of like, we'll live to fight another day.

So. Alright, so back to what you said, origins, right? So this was 2019. And I've told this story many times and it's, it is vulnerable, it is candid, but it's, it's, I'm nothing if not candid and vulnerable. So 2019, I was 250 pounds. Dave, I don't even know if you know the full story, but I was 250 pounds. Yes, I'm six foot three, but man, I was unhealthy.

I had bags under my eyes. I wasn't happy with where I was at in a lot of places in my life. And I was drinking way too much alcohol. I was using that as like a mask. I was withdrawing, I was isolating, I was struggling to walk up the stairs, man, I was, I was, that, those, those cornerstone moments, those watershed moments where, man, I need to get my crap together here and I need to, I need to figure this thing out and I'll never forget it.

And I'll just tell it here because it's visceral. I was trying to tie my freaking winter boots, and I literally had to take breaks. 'cause my, my. My abdominal area was so bloated from just bad eating and bad lifestyle and alcohol that I had to take breaks to tie my freaking shoes. 'cause I was compressing my diaphragm.

I couldn't, I was like, like coming short of breath. So, shortly thereafter, I decided that I was gonna cut alcohol completely outta my life. And fortunately for me, I didn't have to do anything like professional. It was just, it's done. Get it outta the house. we're gonna turn, we're gonna turn this pain and this, this, this, whatever you want to call it, these, these tra as or issues into just pure jet fuel to drop in weight, run a marathons ultra endurance events, and get super healthy and super dialed in and be the best version of myself And COVID hits a few months into it.

There were a couple events, meet, you know, kind of meet and greets and, and, and happenings that were certainly instr ental into like the spark that then turned into a bo, a bonfire that will literally never be put out here six years later. But, basically I lost like 40 pounds in the first six months of 2020.

You know, I'm doing all these outdoor work workouts with buddies of mine. I got on Whoop Garin, all this crazy stuff. And, I ran my first marathon and I ran it three hours and 10 minutes. Amazing. And, and Dave, this is not a touting, this is not a touting story. What it is, is it's a, it's an example to those who, who think about this and hear the, hear me talking and say, man, that the John Pryor maybe is more aligned with who I am than the John that is today.

And I'll tell you this as a, as a, as an an athlete and a data guy like you, Dave, I ran like 12 minute miles. At like 180 b pm for like a mile and a half in January of 2020, like dying. Dude, my best mile at the end of that same 12 months inside the calendar year was 5 0 4. That's insane. 5 0 4 at the same heart rate.

Insane at the start. So I insane. So really what it comes down to, everyone that's listening, if, if you're seeking, you know, if this is anything relevant to you, is man, just start small. As silly as that sounds and as. Probably as many times as you heard that start small. And that's what I did. That's great advice.

Yeah. And, and and literally like so many people wanna think back two years ago where they're like, you know, I used to run five miles at eight minutes pace and, and all this stuff. But since then you've put on 20 or 30 pounds and you haven't run more than 10 miles in the past 12 months. And, but you think you can go, 'cause it's an ego thing, Dave, don't do the ego thing.

Just go out for a walk for the first month, then maybe do a, do a half mile or a mile or two miles and slowly work your way into it and don't, don't disadvantage yourself to shin splints and all these things because it wasn't done properly. Patience truly is a virtue and it is key if you want to get physically fit.

And then not just physically, but also mentally. So it all started in 2019. At the end of the year. I haven't drank since, you know, it'll be six years this December 29th. And I'm proud of that. And I don't demonize alcohol. It's just not for me. And then, like I said, I turned that pain or whatever it might have been, and I.

Bundled that up and I turned it into this fuel. And now as a new dad to finish this kind of story, Dave, now as a dad man, where my kid, you know, she'll be whatever, nine months soon. obviously she doesn't fully recognize things now, but in another year from now, she darn well and she's gonna have parents who don't drink alcohol.

They rarely eat meat. They really clean. we're not on social media outside. I like LinkedIn. we don't watch the news. We do all these things that promote health and wellness because it goes back to that theme. And I'm gonna pound on the table for one second, and it's training for life. So it's if things are going sideways in your personal professional life, all this fitness that I do day in and day out, week in and week out, month to month, year to year is because it's prepared for any sort of thing that comes my way that is, adverse.

Whether it's professional again, or it's something that's happening in the family, or like, literally, dude, there's been a couple times where I'm walking my dog, I'm two miles from home and I'm with my wife or whatever. And he remember one time he had a, he had a, he had a bee sting. I had to run home, dude to go get like.

Get the car 'cause he couldn't walk. What else are we gonna do? We're two miles from home. So I literally give her, I give her the leash and I gun it. I run like, I run two miles in like 11 minutes or something. Crazy. Not surprising. Right? Right. So I, I digress. But the point is, is like, yeah, it's, it's, it's near and dear to my heart.

And that's where I'd love to hear from you as I just kind of ranted a little, like, look at you Garmin. You know, you got the, you got the, whoop. We, we trade off on our health spans. You're super young, you're super dialed in Dr. Kaplan. I'd love to hear, you know, maybe we can start that zig and zag here, even though we're already like 45 minutes in.

Maybe we can hear a little bit from you, Dave, on like, why, why is health and wellness so important to you? I just, I mean, you, you look, look no further than that, mind over the work that Mac, max and Nick and, and Jack and others have done to, to get themselves, in a position where they can help others.

And if, if you're not on a solid foundation yourself, it's very difficult to, to lean in or to, to reach out. So they, they spent, you know, the better part of a, a, a year or two, trying to figure their stuff out before they, they went out and, and thought that they could have an impact on others. And I see your journey similar and I I loved your advice too, and it's advice that I could use on occasion, but, but not, not trying to make too much out of something like start small.

And I, I tend, if, if I have a problem or a challenge, it can be, it can. Cause stress and anxiety. If you think about, what about this or what about that, or is this, you know, how am I gonna solve this problem? If you just think about what's, what, what do I need to accomplish today? Or, or this, this hour? And, you know, I, I, I love, you know, the, the mantra of One Day at a Time, let's, let's not look too far ahead here.

because if, if you think about, well, I'll, I'll have this challenge my whole life, or I'll, I'll have this, you know, as long as I'm a lawyer, I'm gonna have this, but true. But, but if I think about what, what's on my plate today and, and how can I solve, you know, a problem, for a client or for myself or some member of my family today, those seem to be, tasks or objectives or things that, that I know that I can accomplish or achieve if I just stay in the moment and, and not look too far ahead.

So I think, you know, for me. Like for you, John? I, I think of both mental health and, and sort of physical wellbeing as being intertwined. And I'm at my, my vast, my happiest when I can, I can get out and do something that gets my heart rate going. Like, squash, squash, like killing squash. Squash is legendary.

Player squash is still fun. And yeah, could be anything. Tennis, riding a bike, going for a walk around Delaware Park. But, but the stimulation, the energy that I feel from, doing something physical in nature gives me a. an ability then to pay it forward and, and to, and to, you know, seek out others who are, who are feeling similar and to pick others up when, when they need it.

'cause it, it isn't easy, especially in this day and age, I think, mental health is real and, and it's, it's not going away. And, and I think the more awareness there is around it, the more, walls that we're able to break down, that you've done much longer than, than many John, is the key to making sure that we, you know, provide the best, .

Chance possible for, for people who are struggling to help, help them see the light. So be your best, be the, so like, there's a phrase that I've used. Serve yourself so you can best serve others. Right? I like that. So you, if you serve yourself in the sense of taking care of yourself, physically, mentally, financially, emotionally, spiritually, relationally, all the least, then you're gonna give your, you know, whatever it's, you're doing.

In your case, you're running this amazing law firm. You got these incredible clients that have, you know, you know, that have some strong needs in, in whatever realms. You know, you as a professional, you're only as good as a, as a professional as you are as a person, right? So if you think about, like, I'll, I'll, I'll speak, I'll use myself.

I mean, going back pre 2019, I'd be showing up to the office with a raspy voice coming in late, you know, hung over whatever the case groggy. I mean, literally, Dave, I mean, I have a raspy voice as it is, but man, I mean, when I was still a drinking man. I'd come in, I'd be on a big call like, you know, ETG back in, you know, 2012 to 2017.

And like, there's, I, I mean, I'm a little embarrassed to be candid. Like, I'd come in and I was young and I was in my mid twenties and all that. We gotta learn, but it's, it's just further fodder for me to continue on this path because this is how I like to live. This is the way that's most optimized for me.

And, you know, do I like to be an example for others? It's not really why I'm doing it, but it is cool to hear like, Hey dude, I stopped drinking. I saw that post, whatever I, you know, that conversation we had, and I haven't drank in six months or 12 months, and here's what I've done since then. I mean, dude, there's nothing better than that.

There is no price you can put on that. I mean, to hear that from, from fellow community members locally and abroad, there's nothing better than that. So for you, you know, I, I look at. You know what you're doing with Dr. Kaplan, who was a previous guest, and man, I love that episode. Shout out to Dr. Len Kaplan, right?

Yeah, Kaplan. He's great. you know what you do. Yeah. Amazing. The work you're doing, I mean, obviously your general fitness, your squash. How about the half try you just signed up for? I dunno. If you wanna, I dunno if you wanna tell about that publicly or not but's. My, my kid Jack inspire me again, but, I'm sure he'll be finished about two or three hours before I even.

Catch a glimpse of that finish line. But he, you know, he's, he's into Ironmans and I figured if I'm gonna go root him on in all these Ironmans, why not? why not try to try to compete in one? So, but, but the mindset I'm embracing John, is complete, not compete, but that'll, that, that mindset will last until the gun goes off.

And I'm wind you going, my, my butt goes into that cold water and out at Jones Beach out in Long Island in September. But, but like you, it's, it's fun to set goals and, and I was gonna kind of end the podcast, or come, come close to ending it with, yeah. The word goal came to my mind as you were talking, and, and for someone who is such a good example for others, and yes, you're doing this for yourself, but, but others can then say, Hey, look, if it, if, if, if those habits are working for John May, maybe he'd be open to a conversation with me, or maybe he could be a good role model or mentor for me, and it could be Max Ante playing that role, or Len Kaplan or Nick Enni or whoever it is.

So like, what is next for you, John, you've done so much at such a young age, obviously in your mid thirties, you know, this crazy endurance athlete, ultra marathoner and everything else, you know, doing a great job at, at helping enhance the visibility of golf and, and the impact that golf can have, for anybody, young or old, wealthy or poor.

I, I love golf too as, as sort of, a way to. To change others' perspective on a sport that is, and that I'm very passionate about. So I, I like the work you're doing there too, but as, as you think about, you know, call 2025 is, you know, fast, you know, approaching the fall and soon we'll be into 2026.

Are you deliberate about goal setting, John? Is that, is that advice you would give to our listeners, whether they're entrepreneurs or athletes or anything else? How do you think about 2026 and some things that are on your radar? Yeah, no, this is, this is, that's a great prompt, Dave. and yeah, shout out to you on the half try coming out.

That's gonna be awesome. I can't wait to see how, how well you do and just, you know, the, the willingness to do that. yeah, but to segue to that, so like priority one is obviously being the best dad I can be. that's n ber one. I know that's not necessarily like a specific goal orientation, but, .

You know, obviously there's things you can do qualitative quantitatively to, to, to be a great dad. What's funny is, I think a lot of folks maybe think that I'm super goal oriented. I am and I'm not. It's, it's interesting. So I think for example, you know, I do all this training and running and sure. I'm using Whoop as a guide and Garment has its things and you know, general research and stuff pops up, but I feel like I'm not as ardent about that.

And so I think some of my results might sometimes be mixed. And so I've been trying to get better at that. When you mention intentional and deliberate, you know, you don't just, you don't just run a marathon or an ultra or whatever the, whatever it might be, it could be you don't just start a law firm and have it be 25 years old now and just do an amazing things and continuing to spread its wings and grow.

It doesn't just happen by accident. But I think for me, it's interesting, like, I think some stuff like. I think if I were a bit more, targeted with my actions, it could be even more impactful, in terms of fitness or business or community. So I just would kind of use that, this as an, as a place to say that out loud so that I kind of galvanized myself to really start to, to, to dial in on that.

But I had a list of some things, you know, obviously growing the PGA and our reach and what we're doing. you know, continuing to spread the message. You know, for those that are listening that might be interested, I'd certainly love to talk to you. Obviously no, no expectations or pressure, but, you know, there's really a few ways in which you can get involved with the PGA.

not to plug it here, but you know, obviously if you believe in golf and what it does, like you mentioned Dave, you know, that the, the, to the, excuse me, the togetherness, the community, the unity, . The perspective edit lens. it's an amazing place to do, you know, team building things, community building, company building, giving back, obviously, you know, companies, you know, there's tax implications of course to that as well, but obviously branding as well and getting your name across all these high-end golf clubs.

you know, that have incredible memberships with money and wealth and power and influence. So it's a way to really get in front of some incredible people, but also obviously to give back, but too on the section side. the PGA section itself, you know, it's a great place to grow your business. So we have, like Michelob Ultra, we have Oakley, we have, you know, some really big brands all the way to some small brands that, are really aligning themselves with the professionals that are in our section.

But also then again, the clubs, the members, the, the top end people. So anyway, growing. The PGA would be, would be, you know, the top of list. Outside of me being the best dad and, and, and, you know, person that I can be. And then yes, some, definitely some ultra marathons. So I got the a hundred miler coming up in September.

It's September 5th. so we're gonna, my sister actually and her hub are gonna, grant are gonna, her name's Erica and Grant there. They're gonna crew chief. so one thing I learned from the mind over was I did it self-sustained and I was injured and a new dad and all this stuff. Like, you know, honestly, if I didn't have the injury, I really do think I could have touched the century Mark.

but I didn't. I, I watched what Max and Nick were doing, dude, and, you know, they, I mean it's sort event and they have the re they have the great connections, put the work in to get the resources. They got the tent, the heater, the, the homemade food from the Patina two 50 guy here. I'm eating these disgusting.

Cheese, Turkey sandwiches that aren't even cooked. I'm, I'm eating bagels and tons of cream cheese and barely sat. I didn't really change. I mean, there were so many things I did that I, I, I did an after action report, you know, military term and I'm like, man, you know, yeah, I was injured, but there's probably some things in there that I would've gotten me an extra five or 10 miles.

But I say that to say that. yeah, my sister and her husband are gonna be my crew chief's, actual like, support system on a hundred. And the goal is more than a hundred, but it's a, it'll start, you know, probably, probably do it like at 12:00 PM as well. Like we did mind over and then finish 12:00 PM the following day, and that'll be early September, leading into the home opener that weekend.

So, thanks Erica, and Grant for signing up for that. And then, you know, it's funny, one thing that that hasn't been talked too much about is, . So I have my consultancy osmosis, and that's been around now for about six years and that's really like coaching growth stuff, LinkedIn workshops, business development support, branding, et cetera.

but I actually have a sports technology startup called Brand Lead, B-R-A-N-D-L-E-T-E. And I know Eric and the crew here in SEP are aware of it, but I kind of stepped away a little bit, kind of, you know, just like a silent, if you will partner here and there. I would support for the last like year and a half or so with, my co-founders.

but now that things have really made moves, it's basically a 360 degree platform that's around the NIL space that helps high school and college athletes really maximize their brand. that's a great shout out. It's pretty cool. Yeah, that's awesome. We launched it, we had a soft launch on Friday, August 1st, and, .

You know, the pricing models are built. You know, we've got the backend bill, we have an AI coach in there. there's some really serious firepower, techno, technologically speaking, and our team is amazing. We've got some really incredible people who've done some great things for, you know, we're talking Microsoft, we're talking, we're talking discovery, we're talking, ESPN, Yahoo Sports.

And so anyway, so there's some cool things happening there where I think, I'm gonna go back to kind of like the early mornings, the moonlighting and the weekends kind of thing. And, you know, here and there I might have to hop on a call, but that is heating up. And, we we're working on some partnerships with some local universities and colleges, and so that's gonna be something that I'm gonna have to really like look at and, and, you know, again, be mindful and intentional, deliberate about time spent.

And then even then, just lastly, like, just like raising capital for that. I'm, I'm gonna be on the kind of, on the, on the trail for that. So that's really the few things, if you will, that are, that are in the future. and super excited and just be. You're just grateful to be collaborating with you, Dave.

What, what's in your future with 25 years just being marked this year for you and the firm? That's, that's a great question, John, and I think, you know, we got a ton of moment as a firm right now. We're, I'm heading out to Rochester and then Syracuse, we've just opened an office in Syracuse. So I'm gonna go meet with our two lawyers to, who have launched that office and then onto Albany and Saratoga Springs on Wednesday to spend the day with those 10 lawyers.

So, you know, we have a good story to tell. I think the key for, me is, is to make sure that we've got 80 lawyers aligned on what our plan is, what our strategy is, and, and to get out there and to be able to tell our story to others. You know, we're, we're still a scrappy, you know, overachieving, punch above our weight class firm, and we just, we have an opportunity and that's, that's what excites me most about the future per personally, professionally is, is sort of in, in, as I listen to you.

Two, I think about potential and I was gonna sort of end the podcast with, encouraging our listeners to, to reach out to you. because you know, your enthusiasm is contagious, John and everyone that knows you, that is a phrase that I think would be, used frequently to describe you. And I think of the potential that you have, and the potential impact that you could have on an individual.

Whether it's, telling your story or, or coaching them or mentoring them, and then the, opportunity or ability that my organization has, but you in turn, have an ability to have such a profound impact on our community because of the level of enthusiasm, excitement, energy, positive energy that you bring.

So, you know, I challenge you, and I'm sure you you'd throw it right back at me, but to, to try to maximize. That potential that you have that maybe others don't have to pay it forward a little bit and, and you just outlined five or six different ways, whether it's, you know, being a dad or, or promoting the PGA or, or you know, the startup that you're still working on.

Man, you got a ton of, of like, arrows in that quiver. And, and I know 2026 is gonna be a banner year for you. So we're definitely having you back hopeful after, after, after, after the all chop. I'm gonna be the full on host though, because I wanna, I, dude as I sit here, candidly, I'm nothing. Well, Eric's gotta go home soon.

I know. Eric's like, man, I gotta get outta here, dude. This has been my longest one yet. So, I mean, we should be proud of that. We should be proud of that. So there's, that's gonna be, I didn't know if I could make it an hour walking around Delaware Park. I didn't know if I could make it an hour on a podcast.

We've done both things. Hour 14, brother. I mean, I know in all sincerity, I, I sat here as, I was kind of like the brain just kind of going on, buzzing off a little bit of how I've, all these other questions in my outline that I didn't get to with you. So we might have to do a part two, but really I'm in, we'll flip.

The script. Yeah. It's all, well, look, it, it's, and listen, at the end of the day, podcasts are great, but the, the, the key to podcasts are, you know, you want to get a few things, you want some energy and some, some insight, but maybe even that action, that inspiration of action that says, you know, I am gonna go, I haven't, you know, ran or walked or moved my body in the right way, so I'm gonna go put that half block in or that block in whatever it is today.

Or I'm gonna start up a company that I've been wanting to start up or I'm gonna cut out whatever it is, right? And so that's part of why we're sitting here today. It's not to just, you know, you know, do the back tell stories. Yeah, tell stories and make jokes and all these anecdotal things that might just be unique to us, but it's really, truly about those that are listening.

And to sit, to think that I'm sitting here where some of these incredible leaders have, have sat in this. The same char I'm sitting in is pretty incredible. And the fact that I kind of connected it is wild. So just keep dreaming those, not that I'm trying to give unlisted advice, but just right. Keep, keep dreaming, keep swinging that bat, that club, whatever it is.

because you get to then sit in front of an incredible person like Dave Fallsgraph here with this beautiful studio and Incept Digital and, and talk through some great stories and, and this is just the beginning. So shout out to you Dave. Thanks, John. That was awesome. That was awesome. Thanks. Thanks for your time today.

Yeah, yeah. See everyone.