Larry Quinn of Great Point Studios & The Golisano Institute

[00:00:00] Welcome, everyone, to year three of Rupp, Falls Graf's Empire State Entrepreneurs and New York Business Law Podcast, a really fun and informative forum for us to help showcase our clients, strategic partners, and community leaders like my guest today, to talk about relevant issues for business owners, entrepreneurs, and, and, you know, everyone in our community.
So, um, it's a really great forum, and I'm really proud to be, uh, the managing partner of Rupp, Falls Graf, a full-service law firm headquartered right here in the Liberty Building in downtown Buffalo. And, uh, it's been a great, uh, 26 years that, uh, we've been able to build this really unique and special law firm, and it's allowed me to develop strong relationships with great individuals in our community, like my guest, Larry Quinn.
And before I get to Larry, I did wanna take a moment to thank Mike and Eric and all of our friends at Incept, uh, [00:01:00] for allowing us once again to host this podcast in a really, uh, cool and unique, um, perhaps one-of-a-kind in our community podcast studio. So with that, thank you, Mike and Eric. Um, I wanna turn it over to my good friend, um, longtime friend, Larry Quinn.
And as most of you know, our listeners, um, you know, Larry has done just about everything there is to do in, in our community. And, uh, he's currently engaged with a handful of different initiatives that we'll talk about today, including something pretty exciting right up the street here at the, at the Golisano Institute.
So, uh, welcome, Larry. Thank you for taking time to be with me today. Thanks, Dave. Um, before we get to what you're working on today, I think it would help our listeners, 'cause you've had such a varied career, Larry, and, and been involved in professional sports and politics and community initiatives, but could, could you give our listeners, for those who don't know you as well as I do, a little bit, uh, of background when it comes to, you know, where you grew up, [00:02:00] your, your family.
I know values you developed happened early on, your, you know, maybe time in New York City or your education. Just give us a- Right ... give us a sense of what, what led you to this point today. Well, my mom and dad are from Chicago. Uh, we never lived there as a family, but very close ties to the city because all my, uh, relatives are there.
We, uh, moved from... And my dad, after the war- Uh, was an engineer and transferred a lot in his young career. So we kind of bounced around the East Coast and moved here when I was five. So although I isn't, wasn't born in Buffalo, I consider myself a Buffalo person. Grew up in Snyder, um, went to Canisius High School, and went on to Notre Dame for college.
And, uh, after that, my career has been pretty interesting, I guess. I, uh- You think? I... Yeah. I came out of Notre Dame and, and ended up working for, uh, Max McCarthy and Mayor Makowski as a very young guy. Um, and during that period of time, economic [00:03:00] development was in its earliest stages, and I was asked to help get the, uh, Erie County Industrial Development Agency organized, and I ended up being the only staff person there at a very young age, uh, working for the, the great Vic Raseer, who had passed away a long, long time ago, and Dan Roblin, who was also a great community leader.
And they formed the first part of that. Now it's, God, it's gotta be 50 years old at least. Um, but I was there in the early stages and, uh, right around that time, uh, Jim Griffin was elected mayor. I met him. He hired me, and I became the, uh, youngest commissioner in the city. I was, I don't know, I think 24 years old.
So it was a-- That was a great experience. He was a great leader. Uh, really, you know, look, it's an overwork phrase, but tell it like it is. Jimmy was a really straight shooter and got a lot done. And then I, uh, moved to New York in [00:04:00] 1982, um, to work for a development group there. And, uh, we did a number of projects in Manhattan and in Brooklyn and in Princeton and moved back here in '92 when Mr.
Knox recruited me to, uh, build the arena. And from there, uh, after he passed away in a series of things, I became president, left there under the Regas regime and, uh, ended up working a little bit for the Pittsburgh Penguins, Mario Lemieux. Built a building downtown and then came back and bought the team with Tom Golisano in 2003.
Uh, and I think we had a really great run. It was fun. Uh, sold the team in 2011 and, uh, you know, since then it's just a lot of different things. Was on the, on the school board for five years. God bless you. Yeah, God bless me is right. Uh, recently helped develop, uh, the, uh, Great Point Studios on Niagara Street with the Rich [00:05:00] family and, and, uh, uh, Great Point Media.
And, uh, all that time, I, I maintained a close relationship with Tom Golisano, and we would talk a lot during my, uh, tenure on the school board about really what's wrong with education and, and, and the, the so many, many primarily city kids, but kids in general being left behind and being excluded from real opportunities.
And Tom, uh, is a very passionate guy, incredible philanthropist, has given already away several billion dollars to children's hospitals around the country and to s- Special Olympics And his passion was to sort of disrupt the process by which we, we, uh, bring kids from high school into the workforce, and he had this, this vision of having a two-year program where they learned every single thing you would really need to know to become either an [00:06:00] entrepreneur in business by yourself or what they call at the institute an, an intrapreneur, which is somebody that is very entrepreneurial within an existing company.
And, um, the dream was realized several years ago. We started in, in, uh, Rochester. Um, we're incrementally growing now and, and, uh, it's been wildly successful. We place something like 90% of our graduates in jobs, and the only reason we don't do 100% is a lot of, uh, the students after two years decide to maybe either go into, uh, you know, a bachelor's degree somewhere or start their own business or, you know.
So it's been very successful. It's all business-oriented. We teach Finance 1 and 2, Accounting, Public Speaking. Uh, we have a m- robust AI program in the, uh, institute. And the cool thing about it is your maximum tuition is $9,000, so you're... And we don't have a summer break. So you go in there, and two years [00:07:00] in maximum, you've paid $18,000.
All of our cre- our courses are accredited with different universities, so you've not really lost any time in terms of the college progression. Uh, Niagara University locally, uh, I believe Daemen as well, uh, St. John Fisher, Syracuse University, RIT. So all of our c- courses are accredited, so it's a great program and, um, when people get out, it's really amazing.
We have, you know, rules. We, you, you know, if you're not on time, we close the door. You gotta be on time. Uh, we teach dress code. Um, we teach interviewing. And different maybe than a lot of colleges and universities, our faculty is a, is a nine-to-five faculty, meaning they don't just walk in and teach a course and leave.
They're there the whole day. They interact- That's great ... with the students the whole day. Um, and we find it's... And, and it's also very reliant on direct work experience. So if over two years, I think it's [00:08:00] like eight s- uh, segments. After the second one, you're, you're working part-time in a business. Um, by your last segment, you're almost 75% in a business.
Um, class lets out every day at 1:00 in the afternoon 'cause we recognize that people need to... They may have jobs, they may have, you know. Um, so I think it's a... And, and Tom has been unbelievably, uh Philanthropic in that he funds the whole thing. It co- and for-- It costs a lot of money. We're now, um, renovating the old Buffalo News building downtown.
It's gonna be a very exciting space, and we open in the fall. So it's- And that'll be the headquarters for the Buffalo- It'll be the Buffalo region, yeah. And it's, it's, uh... This building lends itself to some very special things that, uh, we normally wouldn't be able to do. We w- One of our key aspects of the program is called Speaking From Experience, and every Wednesday they bring in people to talk directly to students and You know, it's a [00:09:00] wide range of people, but we've had, uh, Bill Geisel from Rich Products.
We've had Jim Boeheim from Syracuse University. Wow. Wow. We've had, um, Tim Shriver from the Kennedy Family- Sure ... Special Olympics. Um, we've had, uh, I'm trying to think of his name, but the, the guy that started Domino Pizza. We, we have... So it's not, you know, uh, low level at all. And in Buffalo, uh, for speaking of experience, we're...
from experience, we're building a, a beautiful forum that'll seat up to 700 people. So we envision... And it's got like a 38-foot long, eight-foot high interactive video wall. Uh- Incredible ... just really, really cool stuff. And we envision this space to be more than just for our forums. We're expecting, um, a lot of community involvement there.
Uh, we've already talked to a number of companies in having their annual meetings there. Had talked to- Incredible ... different speakers about coming in and doing presentations. So it's, it's gonna be a very, uh, exciting thing when it opens. And when, and when is it, uh, at this time, ballpark scheduled to [00:10:00] open?
Uh, September. September. Oh, pretty soon. Yeah. I mean, we, uh- Right around the corner ... we're hitting the runway, and we might have to have foam on the runway when we get there, but- ... no, we're, we're, we're, we're gonna be there, and it's, it's gonna be very special. Uh, and I, I wanna, I wanna dig in a little bit about the impact you think that the Golisano Institute will have in our community, but before doing so, a couple things you said in your background, uh, were sort of, um, interesting to me and maybe even news to me despite, you know, our, our friendship and, and- Yeah
me knowing you for a long time. You know, sort of the names Victor Raiser and Dan Roblin- Yeah ... and, and- Yeah ... obviously Mayor Griffin. But L- Larry, when you said, so '82, um, you're working hard. You had an opportunity to come back here essentially to your hometown. '92. Uh, uh, '92. Yeah. But tell me about the interim period when, when you were in Buffalo but decided to head to New York City.
Um, give, give me a sense, and our, our listeners a sense of your mindset, which prompted you to, to, you know, go to New York and sort of take a [00:11:00] chance with- Yeah ... in, in a bigger market. But then your decision, I think maybe more importantly, to come back- Yeah ... 'cause I know a lot of people, uh, oftentimes wonder what opportunities would present themselves here in Buffalo.
So if, if you can remember going back to that time. Yeah. No, I can remember. I mean, first of all, opportunities are never, uh, clear. Um, y- you know, so thus the, the, the term risk. I mean, you, you can think you see something, but it's never certain. It's never guaranteed. And so I, I was taught to take risk. Um- relate a funny story.
I, I don't mean to offend- Please ... the lawyers in the room, but, um- When I was- That's okay. ... graduating from school, uh, that year when we were seniors, they instituted this new policy that you couldn't get your diploma unless you did an exit interview with a professor. And a lot of kids just went to some guy they were friendly with and he'd sign their letter, but the professor I chose made me come to his office, [00:12:00] talk to me, and knew me pretty well, and he said, "What are your plans?"
I said, "Well, I've been accepted at Albany Law School, and I'm gonna be a lawyer and everything." And he looked at me and he said, "I know you pretty well." I said, "You would hate being a lawyer." And, um, and you know, I, I, you know, and when, and when you're young you just want it set, right? Or, well, I didn't necessarily, but a lot of people do.
And he said, "Listen, I'll make you a deal. I'll sign your letter if you spend a week at a f- my friend's law firm in downtown South Bend, and if you can honestly come back and tell me you wanna do that, I'll sign your letter." I lasted a day. And, um- Such a great story. Such a good Larry Quinn story ... and he gave me a book, it was called Outrageous Good Fortune, and it was by a guy named Michael Burke.
And Michael Burke, um, had gone into World War II as a paratrooper and came out and, and was sort of, "What do I do?" And Michael Burke had developed this, uh, philosophy that much of what I talked about is you don't know where that opportunity is, so know yourself and try to [00:13:00] understand yourself and what you're good at.
And he ended up being, um, the president of Ringling Brothers- Wow ... the president of CBS, uh, the president of Madison Square Garden- Wow ... the Nixon Rangers, and a number of other things. And it was a fascinating story. Ended up, you know, retiring to Ireland and raising horses. But- ... um, life is full of great things, and I think, uh, if we're afraid of it, um, we're missing out on a wonderful experience.
And so I kinda developed that philosophy. It's hurt. I've had... You know, you get knocked to the ground a number of times, you gotta get up. But it's, it's been something that I've followed. It... When, when you're living in New York City, in Manhattan, obviously the, um- Yeah ... limitless, uh, opportunity and, and possibilities there.
But something within you still said you thought that, you know, you could have an impact in our community here in, in- Mm-hmm ... Buffalo. And do you remember making that sort of- Oh, yes. ... probably bold decision to move back home, and, and what- Well, yeah ... what your mindset was [00:14:00] like then and? Yeah, very much so. Um- You don't leave Buffalo and it leaves you.
It's always there, right? I mean, everybody that knows that. Um, I was, uh, working there and had been there for a good 10 years and, um, was working on some great projects involved with some very wealthy investors and, you know, some of the Time War- early Time Warner people and, you know, stuff like that. But one day I got a call from, uh, an architect in New York who's a good friend now, but he was a very prominent guy.
He had, uh, Stan Axt that had been with Alex Cooper, the, uh... Had developed the plan for Battery Park City, which is the most exciting development in, in New York for sure in history. And he called me, and I was kind of taken aback 'cause he was kind of s- a hero of mine in a way, and he said, um, you know, "My partner tells me you're from Buffalo."
And I said, "Yes, I am." And he said, "Well, I just got the contract to do a master [00:15:00] plan for the Buffalo waterfront, and I was hoping you might travel up there with me and show me around." And so I thought, "Yeah, I'll do that. That's great." I, you know- Kinda cool, right? ... free trip to Buffalo, right? Right. And, um, this is a funny story.
So- ... our first visit was the Sabres, and we were s- had a meeting at 9 o'clock to see the model of their new arena and, um- Did you know the Knoxes prior to that meeting? I knew, you know, Sonny- Or, or them or- I knew, uh, Ginny Tullu was a good friend of mine from the Griffin administration because she was in, uh, on their...
I don't know if she was on the urban renewal board, but she was on the design board that was appointed after the, uh, uh, Niagara Square debacle, the Fort Mackowski debacle. So I got to very close to Ginny Tullu, and sh- she used to be close friends with, uh, Seymour too, uh, Shorty as they called him. So I knew him.
I had a vague, uh, you know, maybe meeting Nordy and Seymour once, but I, I knew their father better bel- believe it or not. And anyway, um, our meeting was for 9 [00:16:00] o'clock. The person we were meeting kept us waiting and waiting. It's now 10 to 10:00- And we're about to leave and, um, Nordy Knox came in. Well, if any...
Nordy was just a wonderful person. Uh, but if anybody had known him, the one thing that Nordy was known for was punctuality. I mean, with Nordy, if you were a 9:00 meeting, if you weren't there between five, b- at five to 9, you just weren't in a good state. So he walks in and he looks at me and he goes, "Quinn, right?"
And I said, "Yeah, Mr. Knox." Says, "How are you?" I says, "Great." He says, "Uh, what are you here for?" I said, "Oh, we're here to see the model of the new arena. This is Stan Eckstak," et cetera, et cetera. And, um, "Oh, what time's your meeting?" And the clock's at- ... showing 10 to 10, and I said, "Well, 9:00." And he, he turned eight shades of red.
And because of that or this wouldn't have happened, you talk about opportunity or s- s- serendipity. Um, because he got really angry, he started yelling at everybody, and so we went into the, what was the old director's room there, and he [00:17:00] followed us in. And they took the cover off the model, and it really was just a bigger Aud.
It had no windows. It was in, um, in the middle of a sea of surface parking. And I'm looking at it- ... and Stan's looking at it, and we didn't say anything. And he said, "What do you think?" And he points at me, and all I came up with was I said, "Gee, I think it could do a lot better, Mr. Knox." And he turned around on his heels and walked out.
And, uh, you know, that was that. And then several weeks later, I got a call at my desk in New York. It was Seymour Knox. Incredible. And he was very kinda nervous and, you know, and we talked and I- I said, "Well, are you ever in New York?" "Oh, yeah, I'm here. I'm there next Tuesday for, uh, the, uh, the, uh, Woolworth's meeting."
He was on the board of Woolworths. And I said, "Oh, okay. Well, let's get together." He goes, "All right. Well, let's, let's have a cocktail at the Yale Club at, like, 5:00 or something like that." I go, "Oh, Mr. Knox, that's boring. Let's-" And, and, and so I-- It's no longer there, but I, I said, "Let's go to [00:18:00] Sufusia. It's in the World, uh, Financial Center."
And so he came down with Jerry Lippus, and it was supposed to be a half-hour meeting and ended up we stayed out till 11:00 at night. Great story. And so that's how I end up back at Buffalo. Great story. Yeah. So had, had you ever envisioned or, or dreamed of having such a great opportunity to have so much impact at a young age, to think about really- No
taking over the implementation of the design and, and construction of this, uh- No, I- ... state-of-the-art facility? I did. And I was 40 years old, I remember that, when I came back. And, uh, you know, I was a huge Sabre fan and I played hockey and, you know, was into it, but it was just like, no, I never would've imagined doing that or ended up actually being part owner of the team at some point.
It's bizarre, right? But- Incredible ... but it did happen, so. How-- T-t-talk to our listeners, and I, I would love to hear your perspective too on what it, what it took or what it was like to pull off a construction project of that [00:19:00] magnitude right in the heart of our downtown- Mm ... uh, corridor and what, what challenges you faced or what, you know, things you're particularly proud of, of, you know, obstacles overcome and sort of that, that...
What we need so much today, Larry, as I think about that, um, public-private sector collaboration- Mm ... and somehow even when that was next to impossible in our community way back when, you were able to do that and pull off a project like that that obviously was transformative for, for our- Well, I- ... downtown.
You know, it, it wasn't me. I mean, I, I, I... When I-- Any great project that I've ever been involved with, um, it's, it's wonderful team. And so you have to build a team of really talented people. It has to be a team, and we had a great team. I mean, we, uh, Carl Yaeger from Ellerbe Becket, our architect w- ended up being great.
Um, the people at Huber Hunt Nichols, the-- we had their A team. Um, Jerry Lippus's firm and Bob Suedos represented us [00:20:00] as lawyers, were terrific. Um, we had great leadership, too, in, on, on the government side. Uh, Tony Masiello was the mayor. Uh, George Arthur and Jim Pitts were on the council and, uh, they ended up being, uh, great leaders.
Yeah, we had our conflicts, but I mean, I think when all was said and done... Uh, Carolyn Hoy was on our team, Pat Clancy. Um, I mean, we had just wonderful people. And I think, yeah, you have bumps along along, and I can tell you s- lots of stories of conflict. But I think when all was said and done, um, you give a little bit of yourself to be part of a team.
You buy into it- You don't necessarily drop all your ego, but you, you, you sacrifice that and, and, and that's a great experience. And, and that's what I remember. And a good lesson. That's a great lesson. I don't remember, you know, lots of, you know, "P.L., aren't you proud of this building or that building?" I go, "Honestly, I, I sure I am."
I mean, um, but the good projects are always relationship building. [00:21:00] And, um, you know, Hauptman-Woodward, which I was participating on, I developed a great relationship with, uh, Mayor Dadi Yazdani, uh, uh, who's from LA and actually originally from Iran. You know, I developed, uh, great relationships with, uh, uh, the people on the board at the time, with Chris Green and, and, um You know, so it's about, it's about the building, 'cause that's the human experience, right?
I mean, we ... You know, listen, if you get off on looking at a piece of concrete you put up in the air, that's okay. I mean, it's, I'm, I'm for you. But, but really what happens is as you live your life, and hopefully it's a long life, you develop these relationships that are, are the bedrock of your life. Such a good lesson.
Yeah. Such a good perspective too. Yeah. It's not the- It is what matters, you know? I alway- when I think back, do I think about ... Yeah, sometimes some of the building and stuff, but I always think about the funny stories- People ... the people and the crazy things we did and, you know. Do you remember being at the first game at, at, you know, w- now [00:22:00] KeyBank Center and, and- Yeah
sort of reflecting, thinking ... I can't, I can't remember what year that was or who we played or what happened or It was, um, it was '96. Uh, the first game was a, a, uh, a pre-season game. Now, that's pressuring me- ... because I, I think it was the Highlanders, but I'm not sure. I know our first game at home was against Detroit.
Um, but I remember it for this experience. Uh, you know, Seymour had passed away. Um, there was a lot going on, and I'm sure when The Bill's open there's, you know- A lot going on ... I've talked to a few of them. Like, "Your life's gonna be crazy." But, um, you know, so opening night you're running around, I mean ... And I get...
And we didn't have cell phones back then, so I get a, a security guard comes up to me, goes, "Mr. Knox needs to see you right away at the top stairway." And I go, "Oh, God, what's happened? Who's leaking?" But, you know. And I went down there, and Nordy was standing at the top of the escalator watching people come in, and he was in tears.
And he ga- and, you know, he gave me a... I, I'm emotional talking about it, but he was... gave me a big hug, [00:23:00] and he was so proud of, so happy for Buffalo. And, you know, we talked a little bit about his brother Seymour and what it meant. But it, those are the things I remember, you know- For sure ... the most. For sure. Um, yeah.
For sure. That's, that's a great recollection, and I can only imagine the emotion, like, at that moment. Yeah, it's an emotional thing to think about it now even. Do, do you think... H- how do you feel today about, I know there's been a lot of press and publicity around renovations that might be needed- Mm ... but you still like, um, that, that hockey arena for our hockey team?
You think it still can, you know- Well, obviously a lot of people saw that this spring and, and understood how great it is. No, no. No, no. Look at. Um, to put things into perspective, um, we did not have a big budget back then. Um, we had to scrape together Uh, I mean, the public investment there was, I think, $40 million.
The rest of it was borrowed. Our hard cost of construction, not including soft costs or anything, but our hard cost of construction was $97 million. Incredible. Compared to- And you got that [00:24:00] done today ... you know, billions today. Yeah. For sure. And so, as a result, I mean, there... I remember just sitting down and say, "You don't have any more money.
This is what you..." You know? And that's a... I lo- I love it when there's a challenge like that. So, there's certain compromises we had to make. Um, the building is gonna be 30 years old, um, and I know that the Sabres, I'm sure, will, will tackle some of the things going forward. Uh, there's lots of ideas that one could throw out.
So yeah, I think that building's performed extremely well. Um, a lot of the buildings built in that era have been torn down and re- and new ones built. Um, so, um, yeah. It's aged well, for sure. Yeah. Do you, uh... You know, you talked about Hauptman-Woodward. I wanted to talk for a second about, um, another project that you were instrumental in helping, um, bring to life, Larry.
And I don't know that enough of our listeners or our community know about Great Point Studios, and- Yeah ... I thought this would be a nice forum for you to give [00:25:00] our listeners a sense of, of some of the unique and, and, you know, really kinda cool aspects of Great Point Studios, and how that collaboration came together with the Rich family- Yeah
and sort of what outcomes you're seeing already from, from that investment. Well, uh, Rich Products, um, you know, had an old factory on that site. Um, it was actually many different buildings. And Bob is, uh, a great... has great vision for the future. He's built an incredible company, by the way. He and Bill Giesel and Mindy and the whole family.
It's an incredible company. It's a private company, so, you know, a lot of aspects of it people may not know. But, um, and, uh, going back a few years before that, there had been a big fire at what was called Leisure Pools at the time. I think it's... I'm not sure. I can't remember the name of the business that predated Leisure Pools, but it really jeopardized their business.
There was chemicals in that fire. There was a lot of negative. So Bob put a [00:26:00] lot of focus on how can we deal with not only our property, but properties near us, so he ended up buying Leisure Pools. He has recently, uh, purchased, um, the old, um, Agway plant and, uh, the old, um... Oh, what's the name? I'm drawing a blank.
But... And they're, they're in the mi- midst of renovating, uh, part of that right now. Um- All on that Niagara Street corridor. All on Niagara Street. Um, uh, and, uh He called me and he said, "Hey, you know, we're gonna tear down the plant. Now let's think about different things we can do." So we had a collaboration.
We, uh, Bill Giesel's, uh, sister Barb Giesel, who's a terrific designer, and Sten Eckstedt, and all of us sort of developed a number of different plans. All pretty visionary, all, you know, thinking about how this can grow and build a, a good campus for Rich's, which is one of, you know, our great international companies located, cam- uh, c- uh, corporate headquarters here in Buffalo.
Um, and at the [00:27:00] same time, I got a call from a local guy, uh, who said, "Hey, I just showed my building to this group, Great Point Media, from New York. They're looking to put a movie studio in here, and they saw your property 'cause it had been torn down." And, and I immediately thought, "This is nonsense." You know, I, I, you know, but y- Movie studio
again, talk about opportunity. Right. Okay. You know, that's the other thing. Don't ever think something's too crazy. You know, at least, at least find out, right? So, um, I ended up meeting Peter Von Gall from that company, and Peter's just such a great guy, and I could tell you his nickname, but then they'd- ... not let you air your podcast.
Um- And yeah, they said, "Yeah, we're very interested in this." They turned out to be a very legit company. Uh, Robbie Halmi, who is the, the founder of the Great Point Studio, was once the head of the Hallmark Channel, uh, produced, uh, this very, um, unknown TV show called Lonesome Dove. You know what I mean?
They're, [00:28:00] they're the real deal. And one thing led to another, and we had some meetings, and Robbie then said to me, "Look, we're really interested in doing this here, but we really wanna have a local partner. We don't like to go into a community where we don't know anybody, and, and, you know, it's gonna really require, uh, Bob Rich's interest."
And And Bob gets hit up for money all the time and, and, you know, he's very... He, he, he is and should be cautious about how he goes, and he's very methodical and very business-like. But ultimately, it led to a meeting in New York that I didn't attend, but they made an agreement, and I got a call from him and he said, "Well, I got good news."
"And I guess good news." I said, "What's that?" He said, "We're gonna invest in the company." I said, "Great." And I go, "What's the other good news?" "You've been traded." They were, they were a, a London-based company at the time. "You've been traded to London." And So, uh, they kind of made it a condition that I had to help them build it.
So we, we did build it. We've been open a couple years now. [00:29:00] We produced 10 movies last year for- 10? That's a... Wow Yeah, they're all Christmas movies. More than I thought. And we're working on some things now, and so it's, it's... What's happening in the film industry in Buffalo, I think we all know, it's, it's, it's being built up slowly but surely.
Um, the great thing about what's happening now is there's a series of streaming movies being made, which means that if you go into work in that industry, you can work all year. Uh, when the big features come in, you're working for six, eight weeks, and then you're, you know, you're doing something else. So we're developing the capacity here now, and, uh, it's pretty exciting.
I saw, uh, an interview coincidentally in the last day or so with Tony Danza, who's filming- Yeah, yeah ... a movie out in Lewiston. Filming a Christmas movie, he and Mario Lopez up in- And Mario Lopez ... in Lew- in Lewiston. And they were saying to your point, Larry, that, yeah, why Lewiston or why Buffalo? And, you know, they just kept coming back to the people, and Tim Clark was there, and it was really kinda neat to, to think that there is great opportunity in Buffalo to, to- And [00:30:00] it's, it's growing.
It's... There's things that have to be fixed, um, at the state level, but, um, uh, they will be, and, and it, this is gonna continue to grow. And the great thing about it is, you know, you're always talking about entry-level positions. Um, you know, manufacturing was the great, uh, force of democracy 'cause anybody could go and work and earn a living.
The film industry's like that. We're, we're just filled with a diverse group of people. Uh, you don't... It's- I don't even know if it's preferable to have a college degree. You know, you have to have talent, you have to work hard, you have to know the, the industry. And, you know, when we're shooting a movie, you go in there and the car parking lot's full, and there's people all over the place, and, and that's, you know...
I hate to... I, it's not a good comparison, but I'd say that's the new manufacturing. It's, it's very democratic, you know? It's, it's, uh... I think it presents, again, unique, new, um, opportunities for our community. If, if we could capitalize on a state-of-the-art f- you know, studio like Great [00:31:00] Point, then- Mm-hmm ... uh, who knows what we could attract to- Yeah
to Buffalo. And, and it's, again, it's, we're gonna have to grow that business, but I think it'll, it'll happen. As you think about, Larry, sort of the, the projects you've worked on, and they're great ones, you know, Hauptman-Woodward, Great Point Studios, we talked a little bit about, um, you know, the KeyBank Center, and the Golisano Institute.
Um, tell me, tell me w- uh, what do you think the future looks like, not, not just for our community, but for you? You know, do you have other opportunities, Larry, to, to think about? I'm semi-retired. We don't want you to slow down. I'm gonna- We want you to still do projects. I'm, uh, you know, hoping I can make it to lunchtime.
But what, what opportunities, whether it's for you, you know, personally at this stage of your career or our community, what has you excited about Buffalo, and what gives you, you know, hope, and, and what, you know, still inspires you to, to think that there's a next, um, you know, our future's, our future looks bright, and not just 'cause we have great football and hockey [00:32:00] teams or, uh- Sure, that helps though.
It's nice to have that I still, uh, I, I'll say this. I mean, it's maybe not very thoughtful, but we, we still have great natural resources here. Um, and if you've lived in any of these growing communities or visited them, I think the one thing that you're struck by is it's pretty hard to live in these places.
Um, and I think, well, I know that the future is all gonna be people-driven. It's gonna be how good is your workforce, how, you know, how many, uh, talented people can you attract? 'Cause that'll attract lots of companies. Um, that's why I'm so attracted to what Tom's doing. You know, you start to develop talent in your labor force, you're gonna attract companies.
I think one of the great untapped resources, without getting too far ahead, but it's something I've been thinking a lot about, is the power project in Niagara Falls and what it could possibly produce through renewable energy. Gi- give our listeners a sense of what we all know about, you know, the [00:33:00] Niagara Falls and, um, but, but the power project itself or what...
W- why do you see that as potentially an- Well, because it's, it, it- ... a unique inflection point? I'll, I'll tell you why. Because, um, the future, at least in the ne- next 10 years, is all gonna be about availability of power. Um, they're, uh... most community... And the, and you know, the whole issue about data centers- Right
and, and what their role is. And the reality is this, is that we talk about AI and all these companies They can't grow without more power. They just can't. I mean, and they can't grow without AI. Um, so pick a company, Apple, maybe not a good pick. Meta, um, Google. Are they the same thing? No, they're different.
Um, but their future is AI, their future is power dependent upon. If we could figure out a way to unleash that and expand it and make, make it more available, [00:34:00] then I would say the politicians quit fighting the data centers per se, but leverage them. So I would go to any one of these companies and say, "Okay, I'll let you do a data center.
I'll let you build the biggest one in the world. We have the power to do it. Relocate a division of your company and, uh, hire 1,000 people." Love it. Love it. You know, that's what I think we have the potential to do. We're a long way from that. But if you thought about what the future is, and it's gonna be power driven, it's gonna be data driven, we h- we have the potential to do that.
You know, uh, Arizona can't-- doesn't have a waterfall. You know? Um, neither does Texas. Um, Elon Musk is talking about just kind of, he's such a great thinker, you know, of putting on solar panel powered data, uh, centers up in space. Um, there's talk of building, I think they already do it, is small packaged nuclear packages that can produce these things.
So if I were... I don't know who's in charge anymore, but um, you know, when we [00:35:00] lost Bob Wilmers, we lost an incredible leadership. There's been a vacuum there that I, I'm not sure has been filled. Um, but whoever the leader is for this region who emerges, figure don't be running around saying, "I'm against data centers."
You might be, but that's-- what's that do? How can we create more renewable energy in a major way, and that potentially is incredible future. Now, how you do that and everything is obviously subject to debate. I th- I have certain ideas. I don't wanna- Sure ... pull any, anybody's thunder. So yeah, I think we ha- we, so we have, we have it, right?
Lever-leverage comes to mind, right? How do you leverage that stuff finally? Um- And you think that's up to sort of the, our, our, you know, the next generation of the, the Bob Wilmers or the, the- Well, whoever that is. I'm not sure who it is. Uh, you know, I, I know they're-- I'm not sure. I, you know, maybe they're out there.
I'm, I'm not sure who they are. But, um, um- You know, so and it's, and it's kinda cool too. Now, there's an [00:36:00] opportunity for somebody, uh, Sean Ryan. Uh, I, I don't know you, but I've heard good things. Um, do you wanna step up and be the leader of that? Um, you know, I don't know, or whoever. Um, I think it's fair to say that the current leadership, either on a state level or presidential level, don't, don't get it.
I mean, they're-- I don't know what the, what's going on in the world, but, but it would be kinda cool, you know? Um. I ho- I hope, I hope we take advantage. You, you mentioned natural resources. It's definitely- Yeah ... a unique asset that we have in this community- Yeah, it's an incredible asset ... that maybe isn't being leveraged enough.
Do you, do you have your eyes on any other sort of-- Once the Golisano Institute, um, is officially open in September, we hope, God willing, and, and, um- Yeah ... and having, you know, tremendous impact on education and sort of our youth, which I, I couldn't agree with you more, Larry. I think we'll see instant outcomes and instant benefits from- Build, build the workforce, right?
from Tom's investment. Build the workforce, and other companies will [00:37:00] see the value in that. Um, any, any other ideas like that or things that when you talk to, you know, Tom Golisano or o- other- ... you know, community or business leaders that you guys sorta dream and scheme. There's, there's a lot of things, but, uh, but I think for your listeners to know, when you do something significant like Tom's doing, there's a lot of effort into it, and there's a lot of great phil- philanthropists in the world.
What sets him apart is that he creates the vision and the proce- and then he funds it. I'll relate a small story to you, but, um, Tom, uh, is a great supporter of, uh, people with disabilities, like probably, I think, one of the biggest in the world. And many years ago, uh, Tim Shriver connected with him at the Clinton Global Initiative, and Tim had this problem, um, that people with disabilities were going to the Special Olympic events, and because they had disabilities, they were [00:38:00] kinda discarded.
And so they had common medical ailments that people would just not treat. Bad eyes, bad teeth, uh, hearing. Things that were, you know, if they were not disabled, that would've been handled, but they were somehow put in a corner. Um, and he went, got a hold of Tom. He said, "This is my idea. I wanna create a series of, um, clinics so that when people come in, we can have input and build a medical network for people with disability."
And the person relating this story to me, 'cause who I was-- met him at one of Tom's things, was Tim Shriver. And I said, "Oh, well, what did he say when you first asked him?" "He said no." And I said, "He said no?" And he said, "Yeah." And I said, "Why did he say no?" He said, "Well, I asked him for $500,000." And he said, "You think too small," and he gave him $25 million.
And today- Great story ... there are Clint- there are Golisano-- And pe- this is a lot of pe- that people don't even know. Separate, apart from Children's Hospital, separate, apart from the institute, separate, apart from the [00:39:00] Sabres, all this stuff, there are, uh, Golisano Special Olympic, uh, clinics all over the world.
And it's just, I, I- Amazing ... this fall, they had the 40th anniversary of, uh, his foundation, and they had, uh, people calling in on video from, you know, I can't remember which countries it was, but like, you know, the Far East. Everywhere. Everywhere. And these people saying, you know, "Mr. Golisano has saved our community."
Well, the guy is, the guy is unbelievable. I, I know that people appreciate him. It's been a long w- long way since when we first tried to buy the Sabres and they told him to go home to Rochester. But, um- How, how did you first meet again? I think I know this, but I can't remember exactly how Tom found you.
Carl Paladino called me, and he-- And 'cause the, you know, the, the thing was leaving town. This is a great story. And, and Carl said, um, "Could you meet Tom Golisano? He's interested in the Sabres." And so I did. I met him very quickly, and he said, "All right. Well, um, you know, put together some financial projections, and [00:40:00] I'll meet you in a couple days," which I did with Dan Depofi.
Dan put them together. And we went into the meeting, and we showed the reality of it, which was that it lost money every year. And Tom's looking at it, and he was famous for having this ruler that had a magnifying glass- ... and he'd go down and he, and he looks at it, and then he goes, "Well, this thing loses money every year."
And I said, "Yeah, I know." And he said, "Well, why are you bringing this investment to me?" And I said, "Well, I, I wasn't bringing it to you. You asked me." And he goes, "Well, I, I appreciate your honesty, but, uh, there's no way I'm doing this." And, uh, then during the year, and he was running for governor at the time, and, and, and finally it got to be August, and he was in Buffalo a lot.
And I'll, and I'll never forget it. It was a Sunday night at nine o'clock. Again, uh, I may have had a cell phone. I don't know. But he called me on my home phone. And he goes, "This is Tom Golisano. Remember we met?" And I said, "Of course, yeah." He goes, "Well," he said, "You know, I've been thinking about this, and I've been in and out of the community, and it would be a tragedy if this team were-- went away."
Um- Would you still work with me?" And I said, "Of course." [00:41:00] So we, we put in, uh, a, a bid which was not accepted or they-- I think they picked a bid by... Well, they did pick a bid by Mark Hamister. Anyway, that fell apart. Well, during that whole time, uh, Gary Bettman kept in touch with Bob Rich because he was trying to get Bob to step in if it didn't work.
But, um, ultimately, uh, Bob was very good at keeping-- And Jerry Jacobs too. I mean, I think both of them were very, very important in, um, keeping Buffalo Sabres on the forefront with Gary and, and a- and I think if it weren't for- So important ... Well, I mean, if it weren't for Jerry Jacobs, that team wouldn't be here either.
I mean, I'll just say that flat out. So telling and so important. And, and, um, so they, uh this is funny too. And so, you know, it was February 9th, uh, at five o'clock. At 5:05, Gary Bettman called me up and we had a friendly conversation, but I let him know that we weren't gonna do the deal Mark had proposed [00:42:00] to do.
And we went through, you know, uh, i- it had to deal with the bankruptcy court and Adelphia Cable and, and, you know, the league and all these different- Complicated, right. Yeah. And, um, we're getting to the final thing and Tom calls me and says, "Okay, listen, I'm not doing this deal unless these five things get done."
And I hung up the phone. I didn't know him that well, and I said to Pop, I go, "This guy's nuts. There's no-- They're never gonna agree to this." So but, you know, I think I'm a good soldier. I called up Gary and I say, "We can't close without these five things." And you know, and I went through blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And I think I got two out of the five or three out of the five. And I thought the deal was dead. And, and that night, Tom, uh, we were-- I think we were playing New Jersey and he, he drove in from Rochester 'cause he was gonna meet me at the game. We didn't have-- We didn't own the team, but we were the designated, uh, purchaser.
And he walks in the back and he says, "So how'd you do?" And I said, "Ah, I only got," whatever, "two or three of the five." And he goes, "Atta boy." He goes, [00:43:00] "I never thought you'd get any." He gives me a big hug. And then he goes, "Well, I guess we own a hockey team." And I said, "Yeah." And he goes, "Yeah, there's only one problem."
I said, "What's that?" He says, "I don't like hockey." But- ... um, he ended up loving it, by the way. In fact, still does. He's passionate about it. Uh, but yeah, those, those are part of the... You know, again, I'm not talking about the transaction- Great history ... I'm talking about the people. Right. That's what, what makes it work, right?
Great history. Um- Yeah ... it's so fun, Larry, that you've been, uh, you've created those opportunities, but you've been- I didn't create them. I just- ... in and around so many- ... helped out. Yeah ... great people and great leaders, and people who have had such tremendous, um, impact on our community, and, and you're one of them, too.
And I think it's, it's just... it's fun to think, um, about the lessons that y- you've explained today, being more about people than buildings and more about relationships than outcomes. It's all about that. It's really, really good, uh, lessons for our listeners. And so I'll, I'll let you go in a minute, but before I do, um, give me something that has you excited about, um, what's [00:44:00] happening for you this summer or this fall.
Any, any fun trips? Any- Oh ... any places you're going that you haven't been in your life or, um, anything you're looking forward to, I guess? Well, we are going to Spain for a wedding in September, but, um, sort of the big thing, I, I took up sailing after I left the Sabres and, um, and more recently, racing sailboats.
I have a, a J111, and with a bunch of my colleagues up in Youngstown, we convinced the J111, uh, National Association to have their North American Championship- Wow ... this summer in Youngstown. Wow. Wow. So we're getting- That's pretty cool ... 16 to 17 boats from all over the country are coming up, and it... Yeah, it's pretty, pretty...
So that's what I'm kind of motivated on in the short term. Um, uh, and you know, and I'm still involved with the moo- movie studio and doing some things there that, you know, will be exciting a- and the institute. So, um, don't have any... You know, again, m- m- uh, Spain is f- to go to a wedding, and we're looking forward to that.
It's gonna be great, but- That's great ... you know. Well, I hope, Larry, you [00:45:00] continue to just keep doing what you're doing. We're fortunate to have leaders like you who, who get it and, and know what it takes to try to elevate our community to the next level. So please don't, um, don't slow down. Keep, keep speeding up.
I'm slowing down, Dave. Keep doing more and more 'cause we're lucky to have you. So I really appreciate your time today. Yeah. Thanks. And look forward to this coming up. This was great. Thanks for inviting me. Thanks, Larry. Okay. All right, Eric That was great. Like, I could have talked forever with you, but- Yeah, we agree
those stories are so good. You just forget, like- There's a million of them ... like when, when... And not just you, but like, you know, the Knox has told you great stories or, uh, Tom Golisano is so- Yeah ... like, you know, Renee has these great stories from Wilmers and like- Wilmers was a great leader ... it's just... I know.
Like he just- I mean, I think of his tenure up here, I probably fought with him more than anybody- ... really. But, but he was a great leader. Yeah. You know, and that's what great leaders do. They push the thought process, and it's never easy, right? I don't know who replaces him. I know. Renee's not- [00:46:00] Renee's- No ... he's got too much he's gotta do.
He's got a tiger by the tail with that bank. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I think so. Yeah. What-- Whose wedding are you going to in spring? Um, do you know... Oh, you know him. I'm going to Guy's. Is it Guy's or- Yeah. Are you going to Guy's? I'm go- we're going to Guy. Oh, we're going with you. Me and Annetta are going. Okay, good. Yeah.
We're going. Yeah. Yeah. It's Guy's- We're gonna go- ... in fact, I just saw Guy, uh, yesterday. I love him. So- He is the best, isn't he? ... squash, squash buddy of mine. But we're- Oh, yeah, that's right. You and him ... we're gonna go the Thursday. Wait, I think it's- What are you gonna do when you go? Are you going anywhere else?
Whatever you want. I'll do whatever you wanna do. We're staying at the one nice fancy hotel, I think. Yeah, we didn't book- There were a couple options ... the hotel that they booked for the hotel, so we'll figure it out. But we'll-- I'll, I'll go sightseeing. I'll go- I mean, we've been talking about going to Morocco or something.
I've never been, but- Like tackle on the beginning or the end. Yeah, somewhere- I'd love to see Morocco. Yeah, yeah. That could be fun. Yeah, I mean, we're, um- Sorry to have to switch. Oh, no problem